From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Turning on savehist-mode by default Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2023 14:57:48 -0800 Message-ID: References: <87wmufm7r7.fsf@catern.com> <83h6kikkag.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="24325"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: sbaugh@catern.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Dec 16 23:58:48 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rEdcO-00068Z-9t for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 16 Dec 2023 23:58:48 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rEdbb-0002Rp-Bq; Sat, 16 Dec 2023 17:57:59 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rEdbW-0002R4-LN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 16 Dec 2023 17:57:55 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-wm1-x32e.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::32e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rEdbV-0000QZ-1w; Sat, 16 Dec 2023 17:57:54 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-wm1-x32e.google.com with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-40c48d7a7a7so18141355e9.3; Sat, 16 Dec 2023 14:57:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1702767469; x=1703372269; darn=gnu.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:mime-version:references:in-reply-to :from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=a2agj5CJy15La/ptU4T+KyUo4Z9C6Ckh8SWCLc/Af50=; b=RQgjeuubNv69XPeSCyrD0sEqCB4LqRrRBcgcgwa2KGfyR6ufATo1JzcwKjRi0pWyBM 9idKXwDFKhewj/N5tp9h5y4OWPtksKQjjT0czJL+Fe6MXbsZXa7+uiV8jH3rUSgNu3w8 zDz2DjF3OB2bVqmfpj1z1TqCESLHHRNOcmk3GmlHlEMBHpXUtCUUIVLrzl0Qp9jekM2U MA6h6cpd35x1SAV43z6wqFEnBQpzVevHItAtwcbETPZMt0Qgyoz3DRtvGHlWdmclNZVC RazXLoTOzRBLv+3vV097bplgfE5nymrxIsmDQbBhLN8tyocWwayBZid2S2WKrqAWliSd kFjA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1702767469; x=1703372269; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:mime-version:references:in-reply-to :from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=a2agj5CJy15La/ptU4T+KyUo4Z9C6Ckh8SWCLc/Af50=; b=lnwgzO3/eKM9EYfIjf+vD0xCq+XQ3DlzaHU0kdVCHmYwfTFVGYVYVWqweVY6K9n1Z/ vjYo6wRQJYKhA/B6TRfpre3uaLBL3GrFU4Vk1Ewk30WLmcnPfgbX/rEfgQxXg32aidzC TCcysr4RJHYaEMDE48wwc8dwEjXY+lxpIgGoo3Qbr/Txw4BV+QokwfrdzazEX5CD6Oc3 HRP5UKriCBgxcTNt7AZDl5lsfF6CHB6v/rXaqg9eE4keQ0NYQE/AB1jmjopl9R7hOpQE wkQ03wPt6TLE3Ux2oKPv6m3V0OMbsyD8HmXTQoNl6sXAR5ZKDmIF9c84JCxdkr3SEhnH 7/hw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwhXSj2YgC+YwPUh0BLIJpgbD8MDzqhcplku4v4518XGSit76yR NLuFBhr7ZVGzYC9GzbTrKI/JOcTHKkploo1TQtM/XzF2lnQSsw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEHIFBJ1h1ttJ0CmCPtdmBUhsZEC84PSk6Rn64NVzD7pC33XEVcAZnsJSSCQUlaU4aDvAm1HgLO6rEQZ3NdqRA= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:401f:b0:336:6422:a775 with SMTP id cp31-20020a056000401f00b003366422a775mr83975wrb.130.1702767469419; Sat, 16 Dec 2023 14:57:49 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sat, 16 Dec 2023 14:57:48 -0800 In-Reply-To: <83h6kikkag.fsf@gnu.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::32e; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x32e.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:313892 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> From: Stefan Kangas >> Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2023 11:01:22 -0800 >> >> I didn't see any serious objections, so perhaps we could move forward >> with this proposal. Eli, WDYT? > > There wasn't a compelling reason to turn it on, either. "Other > programs save history" is not enough in my book. Other programs also > have the equivalent of recentf ON by default, but we don't. This is my reasoning: Users these days will expect that their history is saved between invocations of Emacs, as most other programs do that (including e.g. bash and even many languages REPLs). This customization is common in many starter kits, and is frequently recommended to beginners. Not doing it is somewhat surprising and inconvenient. Meanwhile, I see few drawbacks to enabling it. As for `recentf', I think it's a bit different from `savehist-mode', as it's only used in particular use cases. I can only think of: mousing in the menu bar and calling `M-x recentf-open'. On the other hand, `savehist-mode' affects anyone that uses the minibuffer and knows to press `M-p'. > On disadvantage that was never discussed is that if we turn it on by > default, we'd need to preload savehist. I didn't check how it affects the size of a running Emacs. The ELC is only around 12 KB here, FWIW. > All in all, I'm not sure we should do this. Perhaps a more wide user > poll is in order. I suppose we could ask people on /r/emacs, if that would help.