From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Kangas Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [External] : Re: Gitlab Migration Date: Sat, 4 Sep 2021 18:05:20 +0200 Message-ID: References: <87lf4dnk0z.fsf@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="6970"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Emacs developers To: Tim Cross Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Sep 04 18:06:31 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mMYBa-0001fP-Px for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 04 Sep 2021 18:06:30 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46050 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMYBZ-0007Kx-9J for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 04 Sep 2021 12:06:29 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:48944) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMYAg-00066E-OD for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 04 Sep 2021 12:05:34 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-pg1-f170.google.com ([209.85.215.170]:45915) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mMYAf-0007Dy-0x for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 04 Sep 2021 12:05:34 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-pg1-f170.google.com with SMTP id n18so2128352pgm.12 for ; Sat, 04 Sep 2021 09:05:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=3UBkVfrUTNXa1e1bVLkmiam5OwcPkXC4pM6tKBcObJY=; b=Z414LAiPFD9gBlnL0rIzFgWUwf0JWusENkAyyCfFsg0fzc4r+9+EjFXqgAifIkwdqG 137Q25ReI70VlMpQ7z6M6uLJCsXuoDHS/azTFVZQM/fAEZpm2Vpu7Hz1sEushSBl45YJ T2m2uPtDqAIN1b3BHJNv3qTPTNAZGtisQqoBuOA/vC11PCzAee6VsP95u8urly21Htw+ +jJDN0+7+ZhZEVR57kfya2GbDk4c10awH5onV17ufCtKRTj1X18GK7qWSl7khgX2KqTu LNx1ceQ51HadjyTerNQ7EJDXdDklVHBnT/AICbPYpvSHa8169puqUJN1TXdlPCWllOpF VejA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532lsuEGvDr9+pu25sPvL4RvtvsIodbeSiS7ZzWVh8nOcxL/Fq/T 2/agiUWxc8cEWP0SFW4hBa3eEthulyqtfiG0GiaF0cs+ X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJynGeNmpF/CWfG/iKmIRajTC01qoOoJCMOJe+XKmV2QE8UfXVnLV6UQWeFTgxMdUVHU+y0amHK/h9wdYkdYZ74= X-Received: by 2002:aa7:8b07:0:b029:3c7:c29f:9822 with SMTP id f7-20020aa78b070000b02903c7c29f9822mr4208022pfd.33.1630771531473; Sat, 04 Sep 2021 09:05:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87lf4dnk0z.fsf@gmail.com> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=209.85.215.170; envelope-from=stefankangas@gmail.com; helo=mail-pg1-f170.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -13 X-Spam_score: -1.4 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:273915 Archived-At: Tim Cross writes: > Yes, I think this may be a 'flavour' which has won and can no longer be > considered a passing fad. The uncommon bindings used by Emacs for cut, > copy and paste is probably the number one complaint I hear from new > users. The kill-ring really just provides an enhancement rather than > a fundamental difference. Yup. I don't think I could unlearn some keys (e.g. C-w for kill-region) without massive pain. So I'm not sure I will personally ever bother re-learning after using Emacs for going on two decades. At the same time, I have no idea why it is the case in 2021 that Emacs appeases my archaic preference for C-w to the extent that it makes it the default. If Emacs would want to change here, it wouldn't impact me at all if I could easily move the keys back to where I feel they belong. > This would probably be a good candidate for the profiles idea. Change > the default, but have the old behaviour in a 'traditional' profile and > have the default be the more common CUA bindings. This would be my ideal future, as well. > However, part of me > wishes I'd not become accustomed to those key bindings as it is a > constant frustration when I'm forced to use a different program which > I've not been able to tweak - none of which would be necessary if I > hadn't grown accustomed to Emacs bindings. These are such common and > frequently used bindings, consistency across applications is probably > more important than maintaining inconsistent bindings simply to > highlight fairly subtle differences. Amen. I've lost work many times by closing tabs in Firefox when I actually wanted to paste something. Learning to mentally switch context between "Emacs" and "not Emacs" is in this case a trial by fire.