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From: "Elias Mårtenson" <lokedhs@gmail.com>
To: Werner LEMBERG <wl@gnu.org>
Cc: "Óscar Fuentes" <ofv@wanadoo.es>, emacs-devel <emacs-devel@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Character folding in the pretest
Date: Fri, 5 Feb 2016 13:09:03 +0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CADtN0WKsMH4dNQ3Xjw2Bk2tK29ctXbQfEdJ96TjtXanNz+JRRg@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20160204.180523.769253593641901728.wl@gnu.org>

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On 5 Feb 2016 1:06 a.m., "Werner LEMBERG" <wl@gnu.org> wrote:
>
> This naturally leads to a possible user option: Having `optical'
> matches or not, where `optical' means `base character plus diacritic
> and/or slight modifications', e.g., o → ø → ö etc., etc.

I think this statement shows how easy it is to introduce cultural bias,
although the fact that your name sounds German suggests that personal
preference is involved.

How do you even define "optical similarities"? Should l and I compare the
same under this definition? They certainly looks similar. What about p and
q? They look like mirror images of each other. What about z and s? They
even sound similar. To a Swedish speaker there are zero similarities
between a, ä and å. They are, in fact, just as different as a and z are to
an English speaker. I really cannot emphasise this enough, and reading this
thread tells me that it needs to be emphasised even more.

As someone who lives in an English speaking country and using English
keyboards, while still working with documents in various languages, I see
first-hand the need to have ways of searching for characters that I can't
easily type on my keyboard, but this issue is orthogonal to that of
character equivalence. The conflating of these two issues are, in my
opinion, the root cause of many of the disagreements in this thread.

My personal preference is that the expected behaviour of searches is more
related to the locale of the user, rather than that of the document being
searched. In other words, as a non-Spanish speaker, I'd expect to be able
to find ñ when searching for n, even if the document I'm searching in is in
Spanish. There are definitely an infinite number of counter-examples to
this (enough to keep this thread going for another 100 messages, I'm sure),
but at least there is reason to consider making the default based on the
locale of the user.

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  reply	other threads:[~2016-02-05  5:09 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 102+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2016-02-03  0:31 Character folding in the pretest Per Starbäck
2016-02-03  6:34 ` Adrian.B.Robert
2016-02-03  8:00 ` Paul Eggert
2016-02-03 10:54   ` Yuri Khan
2016-02-03 15:57     ` Filipp Gunbin
2016-02-03 16:24       ` Drew Adams
2016-02-03 16:46         ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-03 17:28           ` Drew Adams
2016-02-03 18:10             ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-03 18:24           ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-03 18:31             ` Drew Adams
2016-02-03 16:52       ` Yuri Khan
2016-02-03 11:08 ` Artur Malabarba
2016-02-03 13:24   ` Stefan Monnier
2016-02-03 13:35     ` Nicolas Petton
2016-02-03 15:06       ` Drew Adams
2016-02-03 15:41       ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-03 15:55         ` Teemu Likonen
2016-02-03 16:16           ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-06 13:41             ` Teemu Likonen
2016-02-06 14:33               ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-06 15:09                 ` Teemu Likonen
2016-02-06 18:38                   ` Artur Malabarba
2016-02-06 19:08                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-07  1:06                       ` Artur Malabarba
2016-02-03 16:54         ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-03 17:01           ` John Wiegley
2016-02-03 21:08             ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-03 22:32               ` John Wiegley
2016-02-03 22:52                 ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-03 23:50                 ` Sacha Chua
2016-02-04  5:49               ` Ivan Andrus
2016-02-04 21:30                 ` Richard Stallman
2016-02-04  8:40               ` Elias Mårtenson
2016-02-04 11:57                 ` Dirk-Jan C. Binnema
2016-02-04 15:18                   ` Drew Adams
2016-02-04 15:59                     ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-04 16:36                       ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-04 16:47                         ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-04 17:05                           ` Werner LEMBERG
2016-02-05  5:09                             ` Elias Mårtenson [this message]
2016-02-05  6:01                               ` Werner LEMBERG
2016-02-05  6:36                                 ` Elias Mårtenson
2016-02-05  7:15                                   ` Werner LEMBERG
2016-02-05  7:22                                     ` Elias Mårtenson
2016-02-06 15:43                                       ` Rasmus
2016-02-06 15:51                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-05  7:52                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-05 15:09                                     ` Filipp Gunbin
2016-02-05 19:21                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-05 21:12                                         ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-05 22:20                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-06 19:49                                           ` Richard Stallman
2016-02-06 19:49                                         ` Richard Stallman
2016-02-08 14:05                                 ` Marcin Borkowski
2016-02-08 17:48                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-08 17:57                                     ` Werner LEMBERG
2016-02-08 19:18                                     ` Marcin Borkowski
2016-02-08 19:37                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]                                       ` <<83oabrouwj.fsf@gnu.org>
2016-02-09  0:04                                         ` Drew Adams
2016-02-09 12:15                                       ` Richard Stallman
     [not found]                                       ` <<E1aT7CM-0005LM-9f@fencepost.gnu.org>
2016-02-09 15:26                                         ` Drew Adams
2016-02-06 12:58                               ` Rasmus
2016-02-04 17:12                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 19:35                             ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-04 19:52                               ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-04 20:05                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 17:27                           ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-04 17:34                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 18:18                             ` Yuri Khan
2016-02-04 19:46                             ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-04 20:06                               ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-04 20:40                                 ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-04 20:56                                   ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-04 21:16                                     ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-04 20:07                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 20:52                                 ` Óscar Fuentes
2016-02-04 20:59                                   ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-04 21:08                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 20:23                         ` John Wiegley
2016-02-04 17:07                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 17:31                         ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-02-04 23:05                     ` Artur Malabarba
2016-02-06  9:37                       ` Per Starbäck
2016-02-06 10:41                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-06 12:52                           ` Rasmus
2016-02-06 14:31                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-06 14:24                           ` Ken Brown
2016-02-06 15:07                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 16:54                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 17:36                     ` Paul Eggert
2016-02-04 17:45                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 19:25                         ` Paul Eggert
2016-02-04 19:36                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-04 17:26                   ` Teemu Likonen
2016-02-05  8:08                     ` Adrian.B.Robert
2016-02-04 21:32                 ` Richard Stallman
2016-02-08 14:12                   ` Marcin Borkowski
2016-02-03 17:02           ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-03 15:38   ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-02-03 22:53   ` Richard Stallman
2016-02-03 15:39 ` Eli Zaretskii

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