From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?Q?Elias_M=C3=A5rtenson?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Upcoming loss of usability of Emacs source files and Emacs. Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2015 16:42:48 +0800 Message-ID: References: <557F3C22.4060909@cs.ucla.edu> <5580D356.4050708@cs.ucla.edu> <87si9qonxb.fsf@gnu.org> <5581C29E.1030101@yandex.ru> <87r3p9fxm2.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87k2v0fiji.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <20150619090225.GA2743@acm.fritz.box> <87fv5kfrfa.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e89a8f3bab712deb9a05191742b0 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1434962583 16388 80.91.229.3 (22 Jun 2015 08:43:03 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2015 08:43:03 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Alan Mackenzie , Paul Eggert , rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jun 22 10:43:02 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Z6xJl-0003Y1-1C for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 10:43:01 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38657 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z6xJj-0002XW-TQ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 04:42:59 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:37888) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z6xJg-0002XQ-Ix for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 04:42:57 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z6xJc-0006Jc-D2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 04:42:56 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wi0-x231.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c05::231]:34090) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z6xJa-0006Hk-HL; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 04:42:50 -0400 Original-Received: by wicnd19 with SMTP id nd19so69268743wic.1; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 01:42:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=0tsdDcMaRvHnrpcvU1Llx+rCetcDfmVFpmAFgBvuuWA=; b=p2MBkMNX9rdQk/Z8yKhqLeEiftRqJF+nzOXqjIIK4pGEhjMjaTSEOxIdZywPuuiMZB fCnTvFc4t2t9dg9WqDyewTI1XgVljGQWh8q58bO69s6eYtUpbop3Pvx0mIm9xB8aCavJ FwIiBVnh7je++lG8LhwTgfUGn8ry1pssy3YrkqzZXsZOG8ZIXlZTdhssAwsoNVv0HpNS Wc7K81CCEbTCBAUrrnrybjYAm950svK7bDK1QBP+9ogv5hYYtiODwSGjThxFwp9yoAMg aPNQAMUNbAz3QIJKtB2D6RaH+7NGW9KaOeBYHewb4+gV1f/3XGc1hhC+SLl9MQFDRnDk 2Pog== X-Received: by 10.180.106.195 with SMTP id gw3mr29688308wib.25.1434962568799; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 01:42:48 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.27.140.204 with HTTP; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 01:42:48 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87fv5kfrfa.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c05::231 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:187369 Archived-At: --e89a8f3bab712deb9a05191742b0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 On 22 June 2015 at 09:44, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: On this subject, you can spell it "comment and objections", but in my > experience what you get is "prejudice and hysteria". I see no reason > to change that assessment for what has happened here. I've been > through these battles a number of times, and the comment and objection > stage is always just a waste of time and bandwidth. Nobody ever > changes their mind based on so-called "rational argument"; the only > actual result that ever happens is that implementation is always > delayed, and often proponents give up entirely for a while. For what it's worth, reading through this discussion has changed my mind. I went into this sceptical of the change, but I'm now convinced it's the right thing. I just updated gnu-apl-mode to use the curly quotes instead of the old style. I'm assuming that the existence of the curly quotes will not screw anything up (as in: the application will still work and not crash in your face) in older versions of Emacs. Can anyone confirm this? Regards, Elias --e89a8f3bab712deb9a05191742b0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On 2= 2 June 2015 at 09:44, Stephen J. Turnbull <turnbull@sk.tsukuba.ac.= jp> wrote:

On this subject, you can spell it "comment and object= ions", but in my
experience what you get is "prejudice and hysteria".=C2=A0 I see = no reason
to change that assessment for what has happened here.=C2=A0 I've been through these battles a number of times, and the comment and objection
stage is always just a waste of time and bandwidth.=C2=A0 Nobody ever
changes their mind based on so-called "rational argument"; the on= ly
actual result that ever happens is that implementation is always
delayed, and often proponents give up entirely for a while.

For what it's worth, reading through this discussion h= as changed my mind. I went into this sceptical of the change, but I'm n= ow convinced it's the right thing. I just updated gnu-apl-mode to use t= he curly quotes instead of the old style.

I'm = assuming that the existence of the curly quotes will not screw anything up = (as in: the application will still work and not crash in your face) in olde= r versions of Emacs. Can anyone confirm this?

Rega= rds,
Elias
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