From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: =?UTF-8?Q?Elias_M=C3=A5rtenson?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: User interaction from multiple threads Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2018 15:48:26 +0800 Message-ID: References: <838t59j821.fsf@gnu.org> <5B73DF10.5070200@gmx.at> <87muto5998.fsf@gmx.de> <5B73ED7E.5000102@gmx.at> <87in4b6hwf.fsf@gmx.de> <5B741C4E.6060403@gmx.at> <87efez6b0q.fsf@gmx.de> <871saz5wx8.fsf@gmx.de> <87a7pl1m70.fsf@gmx.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000000c97df05739ccad4" X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1534492104 23197 195.159.176.226 (17 Aug 2018 07:48:24 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2018 07:48:24 +0000 (UTC) Cc: martin rudalics , Eli Zaretskii , emacs-devel To: Michael Albinus Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Aug 17 09:48:20 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fqZUY-0005vG-NG for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 17 Aug 2018 09:48:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:60467 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fqZWf-0006KD-7B for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 17 Aug 2018 03:50:29 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:35956) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fqZV2-0003Np-DR for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 17 Aug 2018 03:48:49 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fqZV1-0007RJ-FF for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 17 Aug 2018 03:48:48 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-io0-x235.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4001:c06::235]:37185) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fqZV0-0007PX-5w; Fri, 17 Aug 2018 03:48:46 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-io0-x235.google.com with SMTP id z19-v6so6251793ioh.4; Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:48:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=SaNfRTsGO4GHWTPgQfdh2+XbPSBf+NOG3xRU4ifgvhM=; b=acsNbxxncfN3pnuydzRVGmRiXHrMGsp7A1X/PKZNsMet28qAfPbPwIVwj5VHkdIcsQ AGDtauvC5BpqbmkavifG762icF6+UHP22Bzt7fGXjBSVEH/q70UCnV3C7kI3d1ay2ld3 ey42cH/wTfGacxp4wIXeiOSK1AlNVcSfWNJZ53iYq8/jqeqhhdMbzXB9o6g8Z1mU9W/3 1mDauOyuQ4qGSWNH1+vUoC1JQdOvzqxqgu6pqMNWBEfHLGvah20YQ3lAp1mzJWb7Ccqw /L5dtDDl0+B9pmYti3bUmF2uBOGr0NLwID3Pnmvi98Aom2DopWzvUSme4soxzNS2I+8s wkqg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SaNfRTsGO4GHWTPgQfdh2+XbPSBf+NOG3xRU4ifgvhM=; b=rSNpyZdjZtyW7rDiuPNJiH8sC0Jygf9l4LOUC1UxiCw/D2h4b8ZEPn5vGy1Ywil1m7 GotZUx8eGCaF7ryTBB5UVjwLIt87uNY6BS7ng4KgSg2GuaEW3l6eTtqt8xdXCe2RoImQ h9Puh4WB9VV+UGPLpEyhB8Wuknvh/Y78+qxqxgEddvL8D8G4mRVYr27V67gkCFv0qPmQ rZyDZboRsni0HOueo/7vEoIA8OnNkJO1uKHqA2DxXDhjH6BMxJKWaJ+2lYUOhDOsS0ns PYjQtt07WjoZ4PKN12hIIh9rPxWDEk1oCtP/+TtfZcJ5i9+5t5vve2VnCcPpfkPXIPjv WWTQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOUpUlFZ3JJoe5SDx9brVFHugPzbJyx+t+6OkRdKBLgYHaSEEnlbMuC/ 216ItDQy8b+yJuQYiZI1FLrCerGgSV/xej0FrIg= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AA+uWPxfBjMRzBwZeH/zyyPURie8246QFZ+sJISS1gDGtX2RX0UhgX4Vy5Y4hpsbWoVTO6PLjNmfPzPm0CgZMtdXO0c= X-Received: by 2002:a6b:510f:: with SMTP id f15-v6mr22066837iob.107.1534492125467; Fri, 17 Aug 2018 00:48:45 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87a7pl1m70.fsf@gmx.de> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4001:c06::235 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:228627 Archived-At: --0000000000000c97df05739ccad4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 at 15:33, Michael Albinus wrote: Hi Michael, > Well, we aren't in disagreement. I spoke about the case of "C-x & C-x > C-f .../emacs/lisp/*.el". This opens 250 buffers, all in the same frame. > But that happens without threading as well. Or did you mean =E2=80=9Call in= their own frames=E2=80=9D? That would indeed be terrible. Since I'm already posting to the list, I just want to raise a point that I have been thinking about as I have been reading this discussion. Personally, I don't see why most (any?) commands needs C-x &. Most of the time, the user wouldn't know that a certain operation is going to take time and therefore needs C-x &. Someone else mentioned on this list that a better solution would be to simply open a new buffer, but letting its contents say =E2=80=9Cloading=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D if it takes too long. The s= ame could be the case for things like Gnus or any other long-running command. Killing the buffer would kill the process, in case it's hung. Perhaps I didn't understand the issues that were raised in this thread, but it wasn't clear to me why C-x & would ever be needed (or rather, why its absence would ever be needed). > > It seems as though some of these same questions were being asked back > > in the 60's. :-) > > > > Here's a picture of the display unit for anyone who is curious: > > https://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/RealDSKY.jpg > > Nice. Does it run Emacs? :-) > It is a 15-bit machine with 48 kwords of memory. 2 of those kwords were RAM and the rest ROM. The CPU was 2 MHz, with a very cumbersome instruction set= . So yes, I'm pretty sure you could get some incarnation of Emacs running on it. :-) Regards, Elias --0000000000000c97df05739ccad4 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Fri, 17 Aug 2018 at 15:= 33, Michael Albinus <michael.a= lbinus@gmx.de> wrote:

Hi Michael,
=
=C2=A0
Well, we aren't in disa= greement. I spoke about the case of "C-x & C-x
C-f .../emacs/lisp/*.el". This opens 250 buffers, all in the same fram= e.

But that happens without threading a= s well. Or did you mean =E2=80=9Call in their own frames=E2=80=9D? That wou= ld indeed be terrible.

Since I'm already posti= ng to the list, I just want to raise a point that I have been thinking abou= t as I have been reading this discussion. Personally, I don't see why m= ost (any?) commands needs C-x &. Most of the time, the user wouldn'= t know that a certain operation is going to take time and therefore needs C= -x &. Someone else mentioned on this list that a better solution would = be to simply open a new buffer, but letting its contents say =E2=80=9Cloadi= ng=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D if it takes too long. The same could be the case for t= hings like Gnus or any other long-running command.

Killing the buffer would kill the process, in case it's hung.

Perhaps I didn't understand the issues that were raise= d in this thread, but it wasn't clear to me why C-x & would ever be= needed (or rather, why its absence would ever be needed).
=C2=A0=
> It seems as though some of these same questions were being asked back<= br> > in the 60's. :-)
>
> Here's a picture of the display unit for anyone who is curious: > https://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/RealDSKY.jpg

Nice. Does it run Emacs? :-)

It is a 15= -bit machine with 48 kwords of memory. 2 of those kwords were RAM and the r= est ROM. The CPU was 2 MHz, with a very cumbersome instruction set.

So yes, I'm pretty sure you could get some incarnatio= n of Emacs running on it. :-)

Regards,
E= lias
--0000000000000c97df05739ccad4--