From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "T.V. Raman" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs as word processor / Text Properties Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2013 15:06:19 -0800 Message-ID: References: <87vbzqfgd6.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <83vbzkcx20.fsf@gnu.org> <83d2lrczi7.fsf@gnu.org> <8338mmcsd9.fsf@gnu.org> <83txf1blf2.fsf@gnu.org> <87txf133yd.fsf@zigzag.favinet> <83r4a5bj5x.fsf@gnu.org> <87mwktdy6r.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <83iovhb0ez.fsf@gnu.org> <87k3fxdpmg.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <837gbwbcsx.fsf@gnu.org> <87d2lnevq7.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87ob57rlkb.fsf_-_@informatimago.com> <35e892b1-73b8-4ca2-9317-7eb83e7223e5@default> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1385593582 14123 80.91.229.3 (27 Nov 2013 23:06:22 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2013 23:06:22 +0000 (UTC) To: Drew Adams , "Pascal J. Bourguignon" , emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Nov 28 00:06:27 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VloBd-0005Hk-F7 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 28 Nov 2013 00:06:25 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38213 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VloBc-00017M-Nz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 27 Nov 2013 18:06:24 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:53982) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VloBZ-00014K-1s for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 27 Nov 2013 18:06:21 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VloBX-0007ab-Uv for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 27 Nov 2013 18:06:20 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-oa0-x236.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4003:c02::236]:42894) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VloBX-0007a8-P0 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 27 Nov 2013 18:06:19 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-oa0-f54.google.com with SMTP id h16so8342342oag.41 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2013 15:06:19 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=JJOSD+seY7uxSBhYF5l44n8WzcvSAGQb+4m5DjOBQNw=; b=zXM5rIkJs55kOvhVmyCIwfkBNEzBieAP6o8inyUpIYPlg4dEe/4100bXuC9gTW/G5W 32pGJSLCj4dy5105WLsU+W4rm7sWukJo5QWMOmaumqE575k64PTSNw+IdT0GrVTIq2Ob TPRTSPswRRmT8ZwWOQAR/tdgYRDlhbAP/Nu1gzcdvCOSEWShB4eVF3hARTpWm+48rWJW LPXAo3Kr9wlQw0oi9mSoGAPMiz0cpaySk3dxCiSdXUH0QVbNKL7F/OV5fAeOtFgdQkiD DJBA4llw0wFGNc3JaWWl3Od7diF6TvMKZwf3TwPBlALxWQWbqjnzhxoMZTEm+LJtHI8o vOmg== X-Received: by 10.60.62.132 with SMTP id y4mr12100592oer.55.1385593579112; Wed, 27 Nov 2013 15:06:19 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.182.112.42 with HTTP; Wed, 27 Nov 2013 15:06:19 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <35e892b1-73b8-4ca2-9317-7eb83e7223e5@default> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4003:c02::236 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:165818 Archived-At: Internal data structures being XML is a small step -- but only a very small step. Angle brackets do not in themselves semantics make:-) For seeing what I mean, just take a look at the xml files in any of the modern MS Office file formats. Most word-processors after a while lose the distinction between layout style and content, and what results in the file format is a messy bag of bits. -- -- On 11/27/13, Drew Adams wrote: >> All that said, *every* known WYSWYG word-processor also degrades >> to using a dump of its internal data structures as its file >> format. > > Not sure just what you mean by that. But if the internal data > structures faithfully represent XML data, and the output file > format is a serialization of that XML data, then this is hardly > messy or lossy. > > And that is the case for more and more "WYSIWYG" editors, at > least the "high-end" ones. The internal data structures are XML, > and the file format is XML. From the internal XML, or from the > output XML file, is generated XHTML, PDF, or whatever. > > Internally, an XML representation might use a DOM or binary XML > or any number of other implementation means. But the only > important question is whether the output (serialized) form and > the internal form mirror each other properly. > > (For that, there can be considerations of whether document > fidelity is needed or just DOM fidelity (i.e., whether or not > insignificant whitespace needs to be preserved). > > Sometimes an editor ("word processor") has additional output > file formats, even if it is capable of saving as XML. But > that's another story. More and more, the "real" output file > format is XML. (Yes, for MS Word, most people still see > *.doc files, not XML files.) >