From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Radon Rosborough Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [PATCH] Only signal package.el warnings when needed Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2019 14:46:16 -0700 Message-ID: References: <83k1j7dyu3.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000944ed2057f71fb03" X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1547502313 14860 195.159.176.226 (14 Jan 2019 21:45:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2019 21:45:13 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jan 14 22:45:08 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1gjA2d-0003bq-3w for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 14 Jan 2019 22:45:07 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39703 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gjA4f-0005HP-5V for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 14 Jan 2019 16:47:13 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:48818) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gjA4W-0005GJ-G4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 14 Jan 2019 16:47:05 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gjA4V-000302-LV for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 14 Jan 2019 16:47:04 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-ua1-x943.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::943]:32914) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1gjA4R-0002sH-SE; Mon, 14 Jan 2019 16:47:00 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-ua1-x943.google.com with SMTP id t8so234041uap.0; Mon, 14 Jan 2019 13:46:53 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=2yepb6jvR5tnOi3faQGHqd+a+li1/j+F6GakHeMH6V0=; b=BRYhtBqX9cQaIs/KjOfnSftSIGE6xq9hCiHIdWMNMUtOwGkeSRk98psCQNR6Mtr0t3 JEbTJxZDsh+CD3+pD/mTCCbC/qsh6zMXUicSBW4r7eG1BNhhbrgRuBKVOj7eBS96T7SD SlSoXrFca2Bj+EVZo1xH3k80oCHw/Qa1O5YITxkA4o/EMf91hWxzk2emDvhUNfz4W+ga /LVhm4diR5MwRkmz+xlssgaKIy3IWdzS23XhRL72mTRyj39bu4edOpV26rmVdcAP7VVl tjxlTZdDZ0+MxrF98unTzjpa6e1CmmRtKZAibgwwgArhVl6Lsii1/avUqf3ooPm1F9lW 8Y2g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=2yepb6jvR5tnOi3faQGHqd+a+li1/j+F6GakHeMH6V0=; b=asikeTRMDBjJygjofiv/OxQIqRNywNIMYmzxkWqBuyB5mXAf9tw5xANa0UHVXId+R6 LgfDqIpxQ7SHbxc0YA2v7vVu7CsGuCzk6xdBqtSr91rAZc9iRQB0jf43NsOBCJ5jvT7U xGYo5wr1fMYoiwrIeo7lDakbmKi8Ja1RyzL8Q3bkD80PENSmUEotw7P4iAaDzpgKK5CM ktdE8ubVyzCUFGBi7tRvlW+I6M9szleTvrFALfNOaCi5CXuY2swfDO5FqpkNgRTssIwQ 2t9i3lFuCVS7lbu+TGM7W6A46y9IKL9BdgMLA+eQJdS9E+weT/Xzmk2lMDf1GZVZvYlS CwaA== X-Gm-Message-State: AJcUukdzmra+XHbsyXDwyEIz9JZfRh+5fn2llfxrQpCik/RjfkGs7cCA pU/zVdD9d2UKCAyKRBR5NNd51RvxFbB7s2fAtTVXuQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ALg8bN6aW48a7reynmlVvuTy3Xq0DtMdd1sq1vTjU6/LsrCMhvv6ux8xuxp/JWuPRIimBZa1uRrwWguRsLh16fMr/g8= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:7493:: with SMTP id n19mr255900uap.115.1547502412384; Mon, 14 Jan 2019 13:46:52 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <83k1j7dyu3.fsf@gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4864:20::943 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:232348 Archived-At: --000000000000944ed2057f71fb03 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > From: Eli Zaretskii > Date: Jan 14, 2019, 8:49 AM > >> From: Radon Rosborough >> Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2019 21:17:58 -0700 >> >> Currently, a warning is emitted when this occurs. > > But we didn't actually hear complaints about that, did we? There seems to be some unnecessary confusion in this thread: Also, there's some annoyance here: You're right that we have not heard too much about it. However, I expect that we will hear a lot more about it if we release Emacs 27 with the current code. This is because people who run Emacs from HEAD are more likely to be advanced users who know how to proceed when confronted with a warning message like this. Consider that essentially every modern Emacs init-file contains a call to `package-initialize', since such a call was inserted whenever the package manager was used. It seems like a huge amount of unnecessary work to tell every Emacs user with an init-file to manually edit it -- especially since many users are not even aware that they have an init-file. I don't see any downside to installing the patch, but I do see a clear benefit to many users. Let me know your thoughts. Best, Radon --000000000000944ed2057f71fb03 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
> Date: Jan 14, 2019, 8:49 AM
>
>> From: Radon Rosborough <radon.neon@gmail.com>
>> Date= : Sun, 13 Jan 2019 21:17:58 -0700
>>
>> Cur= rently, a warning is emitted when this occurs.
>
>= ; But we didn't actually hear complaints about that, did we?

<= div>There seems to be some unnecessary confusion in this thread:

Also, there's so= me annoyance here:

You're right that we have not heard too much a= bout it. However, I
expect that we will hear a lot more about it = if we release Emacs 27
with the current code. This is because peo= ple who run Emacs from HEAD
are more likely to be advanced users = who know how to proceed when
confronted with a warning message li= ke this.

Consider that essentially every modern Emacs init-fi= le contains a call
to `package-initialize', since such a call= was inserted whenever the
package manager was used. It seems lik= e a huge amount of unnecessary
work to tell every Emacs user with= an init-file to manually edit it --
especially since many users = are not even aware that they have an
init-file.

I d= on't see any downside to installing the patch, but I do see a clear
benefit to many users. Let me know your thoughts.

Best= ,
Radon

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