From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ilya Shlyakhter Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: CL package suggestion Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 10:12:28 -0400 Message-ID: References: <27y5qciwgd.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <9lty10iwdr.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf302d49c85795a504bd67d4c8 X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1334153582 11882 80.91.229.3 (11 Apr 2012 14:13:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 14:13:02 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Stefan Monnier , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: rms@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 11 16:13:00 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1SHyI4-0008Fn-Ua for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 11 Apr 2012 16:12:57 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:45944 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1SHyI4-0006eC-7h for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 11 Apr 2012 10:12:56 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:55728) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1SHyHw-0006dP-PM for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 11 Apr 2012 10:12:54 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1SHyHm-0000DJ-Qz for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 11 Apr 2012 10:12:48 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-gy0-f169.google.com ([209.85.160.169]:52546) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1SHyHg-0000Bz-3t; Wed, 11 Apr 2012 10:12:32 -0400 Original-Received: by ghrr18 with SMTP id r18so532958ghr.0 for ; Wed, 11 Apr 2012 07:12:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=u5MC/wYQmXuKswusNv3E5XRB48yIXD/5mK832lp0ngA=; b=STP3GaN2h/hr4izGhSYviXOUWGXf9TysgiGKdU34OMJpmW98k3W1u7W0OIsIfLo8Xm v9hSSONtQL8CCRwoFjIfqX7vkTUw2NnxeVDXLchfHo0wTJubNT42sCvhM51ZaG7ZPYz/ 6X60cRaapOIjk3ytqzW5ikXK2BuwuDl8uIySqS1P1zu1ZFTrbAjjIw0FEq4YCXAqrtPn Y2hhaPPXi3PbRjtjAhUWIZHfD6yoeKNFdSyatKEg6EwWgKtBM99pgxYS62mxsYS6M4UF 8ren3ZJTeuMsh2y3767vYvh4WSX1ObNBJfXJinBbXo8wTdC6+fYGgSQFYvOXKW9G/W1o 7Kiw== Original-Received: by 10.236.154.2 with SMTP id g2mr12975754yhk.103.1334153548633; Wed, 11 Apr 2012 07:12:28 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.147.168.13 with HTTP; Wed, 11 Apr 2012 07:12:28 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-Google-Sender-Auth: ltJO1VCMhhl4bNQ_-Y81yjxOtTQ X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 209.85.160.169 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:149596 Archived-At: --20cf302d49c85795a504bd67d4c8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Of the names mentioned so far, cl-lib seems best to me: what distinguishes cl from most other packages is that it's a library of callable code rather than an implementation of some user-facing functionality. cl-ext would also work for the same reason. If the intention is to eventually obsolete and forget about the non-safe, non-clean and non-nice version of cl, then cl-safe/cl-clean/cl-nice might look strange in future code (suggesting that there's a non-safe/non-clean/non-nice version somewhere & the user is choosing the safe/clean/nice version for their particular program). Cf. car-safe, floatp-safe etc. On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 12:18 AM, Richard Stallman wrote: > No: The way to do it is to rename cl.el to cl-.el, change all > its definitions to use the "cl-" prefix and then create a new cl.el > which only contains defaliases. > > Yes, that would be the right way. > > My suggestions for names for the new package are cl-safe, cl-imp (for > implementation), or cl-nice (because it is nice to the namespace). > > > also: should i also add cl- aliases for macro names in CL, for > uniformity? > > That's a good question and I haven't thought much about it. I'm leaning > towards the "yes" (e.g. I don't like the current dolist/dotimes > situation where those macros are defined in two different ways > depending on whether `cl' is loaded or not). > > I agree. > > -- > Dr Richard Stallman > President, Free Software Foundation > 51 Franklin St > Boston MA 02110 > USA > www.fsf.org www.gnu.org > Skype: No way! That's nonfree (freedom-denying) software. > Use free telephony http://directory.fsf.org/category/tel/ > --20cf302d49c85795a504bd67d4c8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Of the names mentioned so far, cl-lib seems best to me: what distinguishes<= div>cl from most other packages is that it's a library of callable code= rather than
an implementation of some user-facing functionality.=
cl-ext would also work for the same reason.

I= f the intention is to eventually obsolete and forget about the non-safe,
non-clean and non-nice version of cl, then cl-safe/cl-clean/cl-nice= might
look strange in future code (suggesting that there's a non-safe/no= n-clean/non-nice
version somewhere & the user is choosing the= safe/clean/nice version for
their particular program). =A0Cf. ca= r-safe, floatp-safe etc.

On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 12:18 AM, Richa= rd Stallman <rms@gnu.or= g> wrote:
=A0 =A0No: The way to do it is to rename cl.el to cl-<= ;something>.el, change all
=A0 =A0its definitions to use the "cl-" prefix and then create a= new cl.el
=A0 =A0which only contains defaliases.

Yes, that would be the right way.

My suggestions for names for the new package are cl-safe, cl-imp (for
implementation), or cl-nice (because it is nice to the namespace).

=A0 =A0> also: should i also add cl- aliases for macro names in CL, for= uniformity?

=A0 =A0That's a good question and I haven't thought much about it.= =A0I'm leaning
=A0 =A0towards the "yes" (e.g. I don't like the current doli= st/dotimes
=A0 =A0situation where those macros are defined in two different ways
=A0 =A0depending on whether `cl' is loaded or not).

I agree.

--
Dr Richard Stallman
President, Free Software Foundation
51 Franklin St
Boston MA 02110
USA
www.fsf.org =A0www.gnu.org
Skype: No way! That's nonfree (freedom-denying) software.
=A0Use free telephony http://directory.fsf.org/category/tel/

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