From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Shane Mulligan Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Help building Pen.el (GPT for emacs) Date: Sat, 17 Jul 2021 14:36:15 +1200 Message-ID: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000012e91a05c7489289" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="5238"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Stefan Kangas , Emacs developers To: rms@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Jul 17 04:37:04 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1m4aCN-0001DL-U8 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 17 Jul 2021 04:37:04 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:47362 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m4aCN-0003Uk-0J for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 16 Jul 2021 22:37:03 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49238) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m4aBp-0002oH-QN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 16 Jul 2021 22:36:30 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-yb1-xb33.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::b33]:40759) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m4aBn-0003Yi-Mo; Fri, 16 Jul 2021 22:36:29 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-yb1-xb33.google.com with SMTP id p22so17945569yba.7; Fri, 16 Jul 2021 19:36:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=W+u4ggkT8QV2Xs4cSTRJ4idPvoNjIQcl6nuTOFRZBKY=; b=lhXCdTsFfHMPEwbY4tRhNzQQN4lww5PnhIAbBaNvuQ9rnj8dRjXg1XXJrvllQnsXjh eym4kMJgHUnJGNN8uuDnbnSal4l+Kix+vR3q1Brsi+zxDcmmjlrysccsjm9VFTj6k3C7 TG1iVWUiKzDnNy81w/SDvnPdKvTmrwniZT6Nf2HsKSYDEUcWqnYXyYAp+nblscTfwoeS b0LR61kcMhSdEN/xiB5RXkBRQr1norauPoyMCbU6UsZvtEoLAWRe3+bDBUPrOIBlQoU4 iEPH10CxwvjBvz0Wq6bqEmwTXYOSAZfInsAhP1P7R4ZXVe717y/xjsMmxRYpJx4jECoz m0qQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=W+u4ggkT8QV2Xs4cSTRJ4idPvoNjIQcl6nuTOFRZBKY=; b=hbFtrb7xUjETWrAHp/+rw+mtLoTfvARCOFlZW+FhBPpw0rhoxna80ygCVXe4cWaOa7 plkAqepB8vnSIiEhna0RCsRIQoiH+OlhJdbfZ2qhzQ6b+w/CT7lSx27FiWpp9UNhdlUv XuZxVQSR3GEl8DClkgm9ZKmOw8r2Vg1S2fjCD2GMT2+FDSNIwniHztlL5ZQXHB/QT6hY 0rR0w33Ft0tZ2IkTiItNsrOZpXyUKb7E70xpjiEKUSETIm5PqCI+J87SbjXTgbDSc2AE IWz8kFKURyJZYwK5q/faVwN/tjycPp7SN5ilw91AEkvHMkVGQZRUTPuMzmU20VT1klXd vZpA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530LL+DgNNH98+qLp+KrV+GqOMHkzF9OHt/cuIEZs++wgqvuLn6A fumShvHN22k3Xmds0wUWh9Bz/viKXg557eAElmoQCF0ZE/Ro6do= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwTAc0JnlesrbntlNpw+821yCgDucTc0XI6ilQVRPf3JcMRPOBsWx644p1nr/EUpUkpi/ItIA1mffyhtpJyDfA= X-Received: by 2002:a5b:5c6:: with SMTP id w6mr16730216ybp.279.1626489385837; Fri, 16 Jul 2021 19:36:25 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::b33; envelope-from=mullikine@gmail.com; helo=mail-yb1-xb33.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:271324 Archived-At: --00000000000012e91a05c7489289 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you for tuning in Richard. :) I think the end-goal should be to have a close collaboration with EleutherAI, who already have an open-source alternative to the Copilot model. It's called GPT-j. =CE=B5=CE=BB=CE=B5=CF=85=CE=B8=CE=B5=CF=81=CE=AF=CE=B1 is a greek word that= means Freedom. EleutherAI are open-sourcing language models. The problem is that there are very few people within EleutherAI using emacs and few people who can help. If you'd please excuse my speculative musings, emacs has 40 years of design waiting to be augmented with GPT3 and I believe that emacs is way ahead of the competition. It's a gold rush really. Name a package and I can name an augmentation. GPT is orthogonal to coding the way macros are orthoganal to functions. emacs has tens of thousands of packages which are essentially just a skeleton for GPT to become the body, so this is why I recommend fostering a prompts repository right now. For example, take nano-emacs and turn it into the best writers environment ever. Take 'erc' and make it the first IRC client to automatically translate all messages into any type of dialect -- French, Klingon or Pirate. Company-mode + GPT =3D Copilot. Org-roam + GPT =3D A multiversal prose editor ( https://github.com/socketteer/loom) Org-brain + GPT =3D a mind map, which automatically generates and suggests nodes, then lets you talk to a chatbot tutor on any weird topic you can think of. VSCode literally cant do this stuff because it doesn't have the structure created yet. The biggest bottleneck to unlocking GPT-3's potential is the latency of the human imagination to cope with anything that departs from realism. I'm a little overwhelmed building Pen.el, but EleutherAI has been very helpful in supporting my project in guiding me to the right projects. It is, in my humble opinion, still important to foster a FOSS prompts repository in the meantime. https://www.eleuther.ai/projects/gpt-neox/ On Sat, Jul 17, 2021 at 12:51 PM Richard Stallman wrote: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > The idea of "GPT for Emacs" is, alas, not an option. GPT-3 is nonfree > software. I think it is not even released. Thus, we cannot include > it in a free system; we cannot distribute it with Emacs. > > It would be possible to utilize GPT-3 running on Microsoft's server by > sending it questions -- but that is SaaSS, which is an injustice > similar to nonfree software. For explanation of this issue, see > https://gnu.org/philosophy/who-does-that-server-really-serve.html. > > For ethical reasons we don't recommend SaaSS in GNU software, and a > fortiori we don't distribute or recommend code to invoke SaaSS. > > > -- > Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) > Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) > Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) > Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) > > > --00000000000012e91a05c7489289 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you for tuning in Richard. :)

I t= hink the end-goal should be to have a close collaboration with EleutherAI, = who already have an open-source alternative to the Copilot model. It's = called GPT-j.
=CE=B5=CE=BB=CE=B5=CF=85=CE=B8=CE=B5=CF=81=CE=AF=CE= =B1 is a greek word that means Freedom. EleutherAI are open-sourcing langua= ge models.
The problem is that there are very=C2=A0few people= within EleutherAI using emacs and few people who can help.=C2=A0
=

If you'd please excuse my speculative musings, emac= s has 40 years of design waiting to be augmented with GPT3 and I believe th= at emacs is way ahead of the competition. It's a gold rush really.
N= ame a package and I can name an augmentation. GPT is orthogonal to coding t= he way macros are orthoganal to functions.
emacs has tens of thousands o= f packages which are essentially just a skeleton for GPT to become the body= , so this is why I recommend fostering a prompts repository right now.
F= or example, take nano-emacs and turn it into the best writers environment e= ver.
Take 'erc' and make it the first IRC client to automaticall= y translate all messages into any type of dialect -- French, Klingon or Pir= ate.
Company-mode + GPT =3D Copilot.
Org-roam + GPT =3D A multiversal= prose editor (https://githu= b.com/socketteer/loom)
Org-brain + GPT =3D a mind map, which automat= ically generates and suggests nodes, then lets you talk to a chatbot tutor = on any weird topic you can think of.
VSCode literally cant do this stuff= because it doesn't have the structure created yet.
The biggest bott= leneck to unlocking GPT-3's potential is the latency of the human imagi= nation to cope with anything that departs from realism.

<= /div>
I'm a little overwhelmed building=C2=A0Pen.el, but EleutherAI= =C2=A0has been very helpful in supporting my project in guiding me to the r= ight projects.
It is, in my humble opinion, still important to fo= ster a FOSS prompts repository in the meantime.

https://www.eleuth= er.ai/projects/gpt-neox/


On S= at, Jul 17, 2021 at 12:51 PM Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> wrote:
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please con= sider=C2=A0 =C2=A0 ]]]
[[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies,=C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0]]]
[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]<= br>
The idea of "GPT for Emacs" is, alas, not an option.=C2=A0 GPT-3 = is nonfree
software.=C2=A0 I think it is not even released.=C2=A0 Thus, we cannot incl= ude
it in a free system; we cannot distribute it with Emacs.

It would be possible to utilize GPT-3 running on Microsoft's server by<= br> sending it questions -- but that is SaaSS, which is an injustice
similar to nonfree software.=C2=A0 For explanation of this issue, see
https://gnu.org/philosophy/who-does= -that-server-really-serve.html.

For ethical reasons we don't recommend SaaSS in GNU software, and a
fortiori we don't distribute or recommend code to invoke SaaSS.


--
Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org)
Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org)
Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org)
Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)


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