From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Tim Cross Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: inclusion of emacs-w3m Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2012 19:09:02 +1000 Message-ID: References: <1346920414.62447.YahooMailNeo@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1346922564 1371 80.91.229.3 (6 Sep 2012 09:09:24 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2012 09:09:24 +0000 (UTC) Cc: "emacs-devel@gnu.org" To: Stefan Schlee Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 06 11:09:26 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1T9Y5U-0004st-7R for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 11:09:24 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58829 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T9Y5R-0003Gq-6s for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 05:09:21 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:56672) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T9Y5F-0003Ai-Od for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 05:09:19 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T9Y59-0003uv-KN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 05:09:09 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-vc0-f169.google.com ([209.85.220.169]:59251) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T9Y59-0003uR-Fh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 05:09:03 -0400 Original-Received: by vcbfl13 with SMTP id fl13so2348089vcb.0 for ; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 02:09:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=ZYT9NWDV8xNJGoQKnzLLdr+AO3tWB4aHPrga5SSJ7qM=; b=kVqiFtQN1yVNscEvXeKaUTIGsKAVHwAFEA/TTfEFzza0ZfJ3LWuNsaEQ/MLlb9WXwg Mxx2P8S6tEpfnHjTZUr+CuuWZGOgrQMM/N0yR9GgOq2jKRd7Yvj+1BwDqY8TtOdcjncW e2XG26LxiElGl7UCd4XI7fB2+4oF9bZAf8r5f+0vst+WunBG6leWPM65z0sdpk81bQbf psScu8adQPMGCt9r/yXhKiLzzKCX76CU7WZlmJQVYy1Pjcbhn02KrRJUjGDZuWzpyCpz 4M1oUChQf7fiaehXyS/W6dUWKYnnwt6gug0CioCoNZ9zSn8r+Ggo1ZORGZKhXpT0/Aav /JAw== Original-Received: by 10.58.4.33 with SMTP id h1mr1266725veh.38.1346922542977; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 02:09:02 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.58.170.40 with HTTP; Thu, 6 Sep 2012 02:09:02 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1346920414.62447.YahooMailNeo@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 209.85.220.169 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:153097 Archived-At: On 6 September 2012 18:33, Stefan Schlee wrote: > This posting may miss the spirit of this thread but anyhow: > > Have you tried using Conkeror (http://www.conkeror.org/)? > > As far as I understand this is based on xulrunner, but it behaves like > Emacs. > > Because it is based on xulrunner it is a fully featured HTML-browser (Jav= a > Script, CSS, cookies, forms etc. support). Normally I have an Emacs > instance and Conkeror instance open, and because it behaves like Emacs I > sometimes forget that I am interacting with the browser. > > Wouldn=B4t it be much more in the UNIX-kind of spirit to not reinvent the > wheel but to use and combine the tools all ready existing? Which means > would it not be better to work on a really good interface between Emacs a= nd > Conkerer and relieve yourself of the work involving the maintenance of to= p > notch Java Script, CSS interpreters etc.. For me it would be enough to h= ave > excellent access to the html-source, the DOM-tree, Java Script code, CSS > files, cookies etc. in an Emacs buffers, and have the page rendered by > Conkeror. > > Kind regards Stefan That approach can have some benefits. A while back, I used some elisp packages and firefox plugins that gave that sort of close interface - essentially, access to the lower level stuff in emacs buffers and reliance on firefox to do the rendering. You even had arepl that you could interact with from within emacs that would manipulate firefox. It was quite good, but not as good in some situations as the sort of stuff you can do when everything is in elisp. If you have a look at some of the stuff T. V. Raman has done with emacspeak and w3 you can sort of get an idea of the potential. To some extent, it gives you an interactive environment where you can explore with new ideas regarding how you interact with HTML based content. I may be a little outside the normal requirement space for what most people want in this area. For me, rendering of HTML, CSS etc is only part of the picture. What I would really like is the ability to really impact/affect how the content is processed and handled. I want an interactive environment where I can work on new content handlers, content transformations via xslt, object extraction etc, but do it in a convenient environment I am comfortable with i.e. emacs/elisp. Tim --=20 Tim Cross