From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Tim Cross Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs in the Cloud Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2011 12:38:21 +1000 Message-ID: References: <87y5zm8qw7.fsf@hi-media-techno.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1312079912 3437 80.91.229.12 (31 Jul 2011 02:38:32 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2011 02:38:32 +0000 (UTC) To: Emacs developers Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Jul 31 04:38:28 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QnLv9-0003oQ-9F for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 31 Jul 2011 04:38:27 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54574 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QnLv8-0005TQ-QT for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 30 Jul 2011 22:38:26 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:35571) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QnLv5-0005TA-Se for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Jul 2011 22:38:25 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QnLv4-0007zD-U2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Jul 2011 22:38:23 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-iy0-f169.google.com ([209.85.210.169]:53320) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QnLv4-0007z7-Jg for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 30 Jul 2011 22:38:22 -0400 Original-Received: by iyb14 with SMTP id 14so6907633iyb.0 for ; Sat, 30 Jul 2011 19:38:22 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=kHuF+RouS8pG7l1eQxY9DXkyWkFEWJHvR0ITk7WUsZk=; b=gW+CvOlforyPCQD0KhB2bJQd13xs1vnVZdvEQMP7fOoGcV/zj3UrIA7W6Q8C//x8bB GLaYcBq+5HeJFpRRdS3QU5b/mJx7TdISRfwOYGrFnpXW35pcEr5Tuex8ls0+9D9q0tiP Y5ycOF1sel5urWYgyk6R4rdvRc1WTJCXextfY= Original-Received: by 10.231.197.16 with SMTP id ei16mr1940273ibb.111.1312079901737; Sat, 30 Jul 2011 19:38:21 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.231.35.74 with HTTP; Sat, 30 Jul 2011 19:38:21 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Received-From: 209.85.210.169 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:142535 Archived-At: On Sat, Jul 30, 2011 at 8:59 AM, Andrew W. Nosenko wrote: > On Mon, Jul 25, 2011 at 17:09, Julien Danjou wrote: >> On Mon, Jul 25 2011, joakim@verona.se wrote: >> >>> I use a graphical gtk based emacs everyday, and I also use terminal >>> based Emacs sessions every day. Hardened remote servers will continue t= o >>> actively not have any X installations for years to come. Terminal Emacs >>> sessions clearly makes life more liveable in those cases. >> >> Does not sound like a good argument. Tunneled display over ssh already >> exists for X11 for years. Tunneling HTML data does not sound like >> something very hard to accomplish neither. :) >> > > 1. Are you even tried to do such in real live (tunnel X11 through > SSH)? =A0Not in laboratory environment and fast LAN, but in the real > live, through not so fast channels and with server in a some another > country? =A0Hint: I tried and found that 3 seconds for redraw Open File > dialog is too much for me. > I use to do this back between '98 and 2000 when I worked for a company that had systems I was responsible for maintaining scattered between 3 countries - Australia, NZ and US. This worked just fine, though you did need to use one of the X compression protocols. On some days, you would see a few seconds delay, but most of the time, it was quick enough to seem fairly instant. While I would imagine in most cases, network speeds and reliability have increased, there are areas in the world which would still be considered slow or unreliable. If you have satellite connectivity, you can often experience delays (i.e. pipeline filling delay/latency etc). However, none of these network issues are magically cured with "the cloud" - in fact, anyone with really slow and unreliable connectivity will likely find the cloud paradigm far worse. The reality is that while X11 was primarily designed as a LAN protocol, it is a protocol with large amounts of redundancy and benefits a lot from things like differential compression algorithms. If you are using X over a WAN connection and don't use any form of X protocol compression and experience performance issues, the problem is due to not trying IMO. This information is readily available and easy to configure. > 2. Even inside one machine and one user always exists a room for > terminal. =A0It was not once and not twice when ability to connect to > Emacs server from a terminal (from console, if more preciously) was a > lifebuoy when local X session become mad. The ability to connect to the emacs server from virtual consoles etc is a very recent additon IIRC. Maybe emacs 22 or 23. However, this is not a feature I've found necessary. I do use an ssl based vpn to connect to my office machine from home and then use emacsclient (with X) to connect to the emacs server I've left running on that system, which I find extremely useful as it means I can leave my work emacs session running for weeks at a time. Tim