From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Johan Andersson Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Inhibit "Wrote foo" from write-region Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2014 14:34:56 +0100 Message-ID: References: <87k3dte17j.fsf@fleche.redhat.com> <83siseekd4.fsf@gnu.org> <83mwimefmu.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e0149cd5eb0524504f0b76dbd X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1390570538 8791 80.91.229.3 (24 Jan 2014 13:35:38 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2014 13:35:38 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Sebastian Wiesner , tromey@redhat.com, Stefan Monnier , emacs-devel To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jan 24 14:35:45 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1W6gv9-00059g-Oz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 14:35:44 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46647 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W6gv9-0006TL-D5 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 08:35:43 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:48519) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W6gux-0006TE-Rm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 08:35:36 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W6gus-0006tw-TC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 08:35:31 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-oa0-x229.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4003:c02::229]:42727) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W6guk-0006tK-Jd; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 08:35:18 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-oa0-f41.google.com with SMTP id j17so3757951oag.14 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 05:35:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=uMBV3um94E2TEAkNca9M9c8fpCF/K2fuG2V+TLIDdW0=; b=SaWjmmqOP1Amjuw7Bp0OFLouLVMoQBprvQakkHJHGmzK5F2yb9uhk3gCHfQsva0OhU PyhUCbppTdCDW5UYfxdK9BaQqSwsD+cXqWTQ16Mf8KIjbcxHky4kVVAwb3eXuyf+dkIC agD2chXng7ylwe0X9Kx1fyhnroIBXpIWk39+vMNY9YQTlJ2reSJl6i7Ioe1jK1/XYME3 Y+MaRjW1OoRY+mIrJhXhPHD2lvLFWbCUKR7WZOQzZskMB92ImaHHp8JYMCryq6WMyomR PlBB7BvnWl2vkfwdfneDVTwYQQqWf0e+ydi+/40yMycgitIBSavQs2E/JgxOmLJ8lewb Uc/g== X-Received: by 10.182.144.136 with SMTP id sm8mr661983obb.63.1390570516793; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 05:35:16 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.182.154.73 with HTTP; Fri, 24 Jan 2014 05:34:56 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <83mwimefmu.fsf@gnu.org> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:4003:c02::229 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:169008 Archived-At: --089e0149cd5eb0524504f0b76dbd Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > In general, given behavior that is old enough, you can be sure that someone, somewhere relies on it. Is it a documented API? If it is, it is probably the worst "API" in the history of software and should be deprecated and removed. If it's not, just remove it and be done with it. If you rely on that sort of output, it's really your own fault and people can change their code. I really really hate that Emacs prints messages when it really shouldn't. But I can live with that, as long as there is a way to turn them off, which there obviously isn't now. The non optional output is sort of a blocker for me as well. On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 7:07 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2014 18:37:09 +0100 > > From: Sebastian Wiesner > > Cc: tromey@redhat.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, > > Stefan Monnier > > > > > I, for one, am accustomed to see these messages while Emacs is being > > > built: in a highly parallel build that is sometimes the only practical > > > way of knowing whether some part of the build succeeded or not. > > > > How do you do that?! Do you really read *all* messages being printed > while > > building?! > > When I need to understand what went wrong, I read many of them, yes. > > > I presume that just testing for the existence of interesting files (e.g. > > good old "find") isn't an option? > > With today's fast machines, that's not good enough: it's not easy to > be sure whether a given file was created by this or the previous > build, when you run one after the other (perhaps trying to fix a > problem). > > > Isn't that the job of the build system rather? > > When the build system becomes smart enough to tell me what went wrong, > I will no longer need this, indeed. > > --089e0149cd5eb0524504f0b76dbd Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> In general, given behavior that is old enough, you can be sure that= =A0someo= ne, somewhere relies on it.

Is = it a documented API? If it is, it is probably the worst "API" in = the history of software and should be deprecated and removed. If it's n= ot, just remove it and be done with it. If you rely on that sort of output,= it's really your own fault and people can change their code.

I really really hate that Emac= s prints messages when it really shouldn't. But I can live with that, a= s long as there is a way to turn them off, which there obviously isn't = now. The non optional output is sort of a blocker for me as well.


On Thu,= Jan 23, 2014 at 7:07 PM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
=
> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2014 18:37:09 +0100
> From: Sebastian Wiesner <lun= aryorn@gmail.com>
> Cc: tromey@redhat.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org,
> =A0 =A0 =A0 Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
>
> > I, for one, am accustomed to see these messages while Emacs is be= ing
> > built: in a highly parallel build that is sometimes the only prac= tical
> > way of knowing whether some part of the build succeeded or not. >
> How do you do that?! =A0Do you really read *all* messages being printe= d while
> building?!

When I need to understand what went wrong, I read many of them, yes.<= br>

> I presume that just testing for the existence of interesting files (e.= g.
> good old "find") isn't an option?

With today's fast machines, that's not good enough: it's = not easy to
be sure whether a given file was created by this or the previous
build, when you run one after the other (perhaps trying to fix a
problem).

> Isn't that the job of the build system rather?

When the build system becomes smart enough to tell me what went wrong= ,
I will no longer need this, indeed.


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