From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Juanma Barranquero Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#9571: 24.0.50; user option to turn off bidi, please Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2011 13:45:35 +0200 Message-ID: References: <87obybg01n.fsf@gmail.com> <834o03sgsu.fsf@gnu.org> <87d3erfrb5.fsf@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1316778407 7688 80.91.229.12 (23 Sep 2011 11:46:47 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2011 11:46:47 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 9571@debbugs.gnu.org To: =?UTF-8?Q?=C5=A0t=C4=9Bp=C3=A1n_?= =?UTF-8?Q?N=C4=9Bmec?= Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Sep 23 13:46:43 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R74DK-0007u7-Q2 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 13:46:43 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40002 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R74DJ-0008Ou-Vu for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 07:46:41 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:47154) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R74DG-0008Of-FO for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 07:46:39 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R74DE-0005Ps-GJ for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 07:46:38 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:60479) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R74DE-0005Pj-Ej for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 07:46:36 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R74De-0002i1-8X for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 07:47:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Juanma Barranquero Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2011 11:47:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 9571 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: wontfix Original-Received: via spool by 9571-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B9571.131677840610390 (code B ref 9571); Fri, 23 Sep 2011 11:47:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 9571) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Sep 2011 11:46:46 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R74DN-0002hW-2I for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 07:46:46 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-pz0-f50.google.com ([209.85.210.50]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1R74DK-0002hO-3F for 9571@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 07:46:43 -0400 Original-Received: by pzk37 with SMTP id 37so7533007pzk.9 for <9571@debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 04:46:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=9UlT/3eWs4PDIdygbCXMXroOVPRXiBaBGPBSN09FeMI=; b=s9rcwooGzIRE1Z9Iblyn7P0mr9XWd5TMNHBgCHwY0jlh5ctAiAZF4yY2MKriMUHlgR KzgNfVkw7WtHlpCOSBL5YRyip2bk/oj6QoR/XuuEmMI5GM3e/H99FVJFmUKwLfyIDjmi i2CgUGSaX1o5D4hZPuBRdkLnbfeJAorgTD5kw= Original-Received: by 10.68.7.132 with SMTP id j4mr9870253pba.102.1316778375215; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 04:46:15 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.142.223.13 with HTTP; Fri, 23 Sep 2011 04:45:35 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87d3erfrb5.fsf@gmail.com> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Resent-Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2011 07:47:02 -0400 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:51708 Archived-At: 2011/9/23 =C5=A0t=C4=9Bp=C3=A1n N=C4=9Bmec : > Thank you very much for the explanation. (I guess "pushing bidi down > everybody's throat" was picturesque in a wrong way, sorry for that; it's > really just another way of saying "bidi will (one day) become the only > way to display text in Emacs"). Again: the unicode merge brought the new font backends, which became the only way to display text in Emacs. That's progress. It's not as if the previous releases suddenly disappear, for those unable or unwilling to use newer Emacsen. I switched from Firefox to Chrome because I cannot bear the new Firefox interface, but I don't expect the Firefox developers to add ways to make Firefox 6 to behave exactly like Firefox 4. > I still think "there is no way back" is all the more reason to be as > helpful and open about the changes and possible problems as possible. Pretest *is* the moment to discover, and hopefully fix, the possible proble= ms... > In > other words, not clearly saying that bidi might bring problems and how > to work around them in the user documentation at this point would only > be reasonable if Emacs bidi was pretty much a solved problem, but that's > really not the impression I got from the related emacs-devel discussions > or even from your explanation. That's a bit absurd, IMO (no offense intended). New features are never a "solved problem" until they have been extensively tested, and then some. That has to be done at some point in time. And that moment is now. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Juanma