From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Artur Malabarba Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Calling (package-initialize) sooner during initialization Date: Sat, 18 Apr 2015 18:35:55 +0100 Message-ID: References: <87383xk4ia.fsf@taylan.uni.cx> <87d231wm3y.fsf@ferrier.me.uk> <87twwdii0v.fsf@taylan.uni.cx> Reply-To: bruce.connor.am@gmail.com NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c387500b66300514032178 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1429378585 12943 80.91.229.3 (18 Apr 2015 17:36:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 18 Apr 2015 17:36:25 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Nic Ferrier , emacs-devel To: =?UTF-8?B?VGF5bGFuIFVscmljaCBCYXnEsXJsxLEvS2FtbWVy?= Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Apr 18 19:36:24 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1YjWfH-0001rb-VL for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 19:36:24 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46400 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YjWfC-0003wA-6l for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 13:36:18 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:33279) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YjWer-0003t4-IZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 13:35:58 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YjWeq-0000uQ-Kp for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 13:35:57 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-la0-x22b.google.com ([2a00:1450:4010:c03::22b]:34583) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YjWeq-0000uK-CI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 13:35:56 -0400 Original-Received: by laat2 with SMTP id t2so100705353laa.1 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 10:35:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:reply-to:sender:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id :subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=wbtNpSCw41aFF2u718rDe72uaIaG49gKqmi1Xlkj6E4=; b=TRJ6WMNGYztq+r0xETLhOUaYDD6BdmxtIBRbBbMObqxlp/V/i+D0yAZvWtRDawxidU GbRUaiDz558hB7axbGxosv9PuKDPX9HH0En+STRgT5AAJADOaw7V+B5kjDvz7Bpu2K7m zAsS5IHX186N8PFcHGJaWWyikH98Xn+vYmxY+LxYiybPDmh29oAXxANaf4ECZkdznxgZ qBbz0FKE+YJmcmVTvdXZaR3y5Ei1fcroeAUe/O+k0XM1HI5sJSTCQcVWp594AHkKMayR lbRwak0csaaM3vqFotWAODk2vwlHPp7sNfNk+sNclvcgWtED3rIOrkRZdqTByw7YxwW/ Hgxw== X-Received: by 10.112.200.230 with SMTP id jv6mr9104958lbc.21.1429378555403; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 10:35:55 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.25.150.1 with HTTP; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 10:35:55 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.25.150.1 with HTTP; Sat, 18 Apr 2015 10:35:55 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87twwdii0v.fsf@taylan.uni.cx> X-Google-Sender-Auth: 2gRoyD7u-zNpEvUN1qHauqpTnlY X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:4010:c03::22b X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:185612 Archived-At: --001a11c387500b66300514032178 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > Nic Ferrier writes: > > > My preference would be to add a post-package-init.el thereby not > > changing the defined semantics of the current system at all. > > That would be good for backwards compatibility, but won't solve the > problem of people asking why a function in their init.el is undefined > when they installed the package providing it. Precisely. Whichever solution is adopted, it must work out of the box for people who do nothing but add (require 'some-package) to their init file. The goal here is to find the smallest semantics change that affects the fewest people, given that restriction. --001a11c387500b66300514032178 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

> Nic Ferrier <nferrier@ferrier.me.uk> writes:
>
> > My preference would be to add a post-package-init.el thereby not<= br> > > changing the defined semantics of the current system at all.
>
> That would be good for backwards compatibility, but won't solve th= e
> problem of people asking why a function in their init.el is undefined<= br> > when they installed the package providing it.

Precisely. Whichever solution is adopted, it must work out o= f the box for people who do nothing but add (require 'some-package) to = their init file. The goal here is to find the smallest semantics change tha= t affects the fewest people, given that restriction.

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