From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#12270: 24.1.50; (elisp) Syntax Descriptors: "second character, if present" Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2012 16:14:55 -0700 Message-ID: References: <326318AAC3364E9BA18F16D23A753C36@us.oracle.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1345850136 5677 80.91.229.3 (24 Aug 2012 23:15:36 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2012 23:15:36 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 12270@debbugs.gnu.org To: "'Andreas Schwab'" Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Aug 25 01:15:37 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1T536D-0000Ke-Dk for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sat, 25 Aug 2012 01:15:33 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:49752 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T536A-0002Ss-Bf for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 19:15:30 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:59867) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T5365-0002Sf-PS for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 19:15:27 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T5364-0001hm-NR for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 19:15:25 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:37962) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1T5364-0001hJ-KF for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 19:15:24 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1T536g-0005js-6P for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 19:16:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2012 23:16:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 12270 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 12270-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B12270.134585014822039 (code B ref 12270); Fri, 24 Aug 2012 23:16:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 12270) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Aug 2012 23:15:48 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47508 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1T536R-0005jQ-44 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 19:15:47 -0400 Original-Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com ([141.146.126.227]:17403) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1T536O-0005jH-3i for 12270@debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 19:15:45 -0400 Original-Received: from ucsinet21.oracle.com (ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.2.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.2.2) with ESMTP id q7ONF2ZT014261 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 24 Aug 2012 23:15:03 GMT Original-Received: from acsmt358.oracle.com (acsmt358.oracle.com [141.146.40.158]) by ucsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id q7ONF1ar011255 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 24 Aug 2012 23:15:01 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt106.oracle.com (abhmt106.oracle.com [141.146.116.58]) by acsmt358.oracle.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id q7ONF1v5032147; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 18:15:01 -0500 Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/10.159.173.105) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Fri, 24 Aug 2012 16:15:00 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.6157 Thread-Index: Ac2CSLY4XYQw9kzkTaOALHpzovMxuAAAhoGw X-Source-IP: ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:63468 Archived-At: > > This text does not seem correct to me. At least it seems unclear. > > > > "The first character in a syntax descriptor must be a syntax class > > designator character. The second character, if present, > specifies a > > matching character (e.g. in Lisp, the matching character > for `(' is > > `)'); a space specifies that there is no matching character." > > > > How can the second char be absent if the third char is present? > > It is wrong to speak of a char being "present" here, AFAICT. > > What should be said instead of "present" is non-space: > > > > "The second character, if not a space, specifies..." > > Which third character? Which? Why - do you think there can be more than one third char? "Which" implies at a choice from a known group of at least two elements. Perhaps you meant "What", and you meant to ask about the case where there is no 2nd char. The point is that IF there is a second char (so that we can in fact speak of "the second char") and IF it is not a space char, then that non-space char specifies a matching char. That is what needs to be conveyed. In the examples given in the node, ". 23" and ". 14", a second char is PRESENT, and yet it does NOT specify a matching char, because it is a space char. The doc does say afterward that a space char specifies that there is no matching char. Good. [It follows (but is not said explicitly) that a space char cannot _be_ a matching char.] It would be clearer to say "a non-space 2nd char specifies a matching char". That's the point. And that's all that needs to be said. There is a second bug in this text, BTW: The first example is written `". 23"' and the second is written `. 14'. One of them, at least, is written wrong.