GTD: Tags or Custom TODO states?

GTD: Tags or Custom TODO states?

[Matt Price]

Hi Everyone,

So, I'm going to try to implement David Allen's Getting Things Done
using org-mode, as so many other people have done already.  I'd like
to set things up more or less right the first time, but since GTD is
brand-new to me (just finished the book today!) and I'm still only
barely competent at org-mode, I'm a little anxious about the choices I
need to make.  I think I understand some of the steps I have to take
now, but would love some advice from all the GTD'ers out there.  So
here goes:

GTD is a 5-step process:  Collect, Process, Organize, Review, Do.

I have all my GTD stuff in Dropbox, under ~/Dropbox/GTD, so there
won't be any syncing problems across computers (don't have a
smartphone yet, so that's not an issue).  That directory currently
contains:

Collect.org

this is where stuff gets collected before any processing takes place
-- it's especially for things I think of or that get thrown at me when
I'm in a rush, or for 'mindsweeps'; essentially, it's a kind of Inbox
(I have an email inbox, too, with wanderlust as my mail client -- but
i'm not going to get into that now).  The items in this file do not
have TODO states because I haven't figured out how to manage them yet.
Every morning, or thereabouts, I'm supposed to check Collect.org and
quickly process each item. Either it gets done right away, thrown out,
or assigned a category & refiled in one of the other GTD files...

Reference.org
Stolen from http://www.jboecker.de/2010/04/14/general-reference-filing-with-org-mode.html,
this is the one file that contains all my reference material.  Again,
nothing in here is a TODO, and this file is not in the agenda-files
alist.

GTD.org
this is the main storage place for actionable items, and items that
are waiting for a response, so it is listed in the agenda-files alist.
 My plan is to use custom agenda views to quickly access all actions i
need to take and all items i'm waiting for.  Everything should be
tagged with at least   a CONTEXT tag (calls, emails, office, home,
errands, etc) and in most cases probably another tag that relates in
some ways to content -- so e.g. a person's name could be used as a tag
to build what Allen calls "agendas" for the next meeting you have with
that person.  limiting on tags should make that pretty
straightforward.  Everything should also have a TODO state associated
with it; right now I'm thinking something like this:
TODO WAITING |DONE
but maybe there should be others.  (i do want to keep things as simple
as possible, though)

Projects.org
This file lists my projects and outlines the sub-projects associated
with them.  Most of these are not _really_ todos -- but each project
does need to have a "next action" associated with it, and this *is* a
real TODO item.  Here's where I can't decide which way to go:
Add this file to the agenda-files alist, and create two sets of TODO states:
PROJECT | DONE and
TODO WAITING | DONE
and then create custom views for reviewing projects (during the Weekly
Review, or maybe more often) and for viewing next actions along with
the TODOS from GTD.org; or
Just tag the projects headlines with :Project:, and only mark TODO's
when there's a next action defined. This is simpler but it makes it a
little harder to track projects using the Agenda view.  ; or
just move the TODO items to GTD.org where they in some sense belong.
that seems a little labour intensive though.

the main work that I would have to do to set this up is to craete
appropriate remember templates and maybe some custom refiling
commands.  Those don't seem that hard to do.  Anyway, I would love to
hear whatever advice people have -- I've read around a bit in the
archives and mosto f the links from the worg GTD page, but I still
have plenty to learn.  Thanks much,
matt

Re: GTD: Tags or Custom TODO states?

[Bernt Hansen]

Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes:

> Hi Everyone,
>
> So, I'm going to try to implement David Allen's Getting Things Done
> using org-mode, as so many other people have done already.  I'd like
> to set things up more or less right the first time, but since GTD is
> brand-new to me (just finished the book today!) and I'm still only
> barely competent at org-mode, I'm a little anxious about the choices I
> need to make.  I think I understand some of the steps I have to take
> now, but would love some advice from all the GTD'ers out there.  So
> here goes:
>
> GTD is a 5-step process:  Collect, Process, Organize, Review, Do.
>
> I have all my GTD stuff in Dropbox, under ~/Dropbox/GTD, so there
> won't be any syncing problems across computers (don't have a
> smartphone yet, so that's not an issue).  That directory currently
> contains:
>
> Collect.org
>
> this is where stuff gets collected before any processing takes place
> -- it's especially for things I think of or that get thrown at me when
> I'm in a rush, or for 'mindsweeps'; essentially, it's a kind of Inbox
> (I have an email inbox, too, with wanderlust as my mail client -- but
> i'm not going to get into that now).  The items in this file do not
> have TODO states because I haven't figured out how to manage them yet.
> Every morning, or thereabouts, I'm supposed to check Collect.org and
> quickly process each item. Either it gets done right away, thrown out,
> or assigned a category & refiled in one of the other GTD files...

I use remember mode and remember templates to record new tasks and notes
for later processing.  I suggest you use that for dropping things into
your Collect.org

>
> Reference.org
> Stolen from http://www.jboecker.de/2010/04/14/general-reference-filing-with-org-mode.html,
> this is the one file that contains all my reference material.  Again,
> nothing in here is a TODO, and this file is not in the agenda-files
> alist.
>
> GTD.org
> this is the main storage place for actionable items, and items that
> are waiting for a response, so it is listed in the agenda-files alist.
>  My plan is to use custom agenda views to quickly access all actions i
> need to take and all items i'm waiting for.  Everything should be
> tagged with at least   a CONTEXT tag (calls, emails, office, home,
> errands, etc) and in most cases probably another tag that relates in
> some ways to content -- so e.g. a person's name could be used as a tag
> to build what Allen calls "agendas" for the next meeting you have with
> that person.  limiting on tags should make that pretty
> straightforward.  Everything should also have a TODO state associated
> with it; right now I'm thinking something like this:
> TODO WAITING |DONE
> but maybe there should be others.  (i do want to keep things as simple
> as possible, though)

With org-mode there's no real reason you have to keep these all in a
single file.  I use multiple files with org-agenda-files listing the
active ones which will contribute tasks to my agenda.

>
> Projects.org
> This file lists my projects and outlines the sub-projects associated
> with them.  Most of these are not _really_ todos -- but each project
> does need to have a "next action" associated with it, and this *is* a
> real TODO item.  Here's where I can't decide which way to go:
> Add this file to the agenda-files alist, and create two sets of TODO states:
> PROJECT | DONE and
> TODO WAITING | DONE
> and then create custom views for reviewing projects (during the Weekly
> Review, or maybe more often) and for viewing next actions along with
> the TODOS from GTD.org; or
> Just tag the projects headlines with :Project:, and only mark TODO's
> when there's a next action defined. This is simpler but it makes it a
> little harder to track projects using the Agenda view.  ; or
> just move the TODO items to GTD.org where they in some sense belong.
> that seems a little labour intensive though.

I've tried multiple things for projects:
  - todo state keywords (PROJECT and PROJDONE)
  - tags :project:

and I've recently moved to a lazy project definition described at
http://doc.norang.ca/org-mode.html#sec-12_2

This works great for me since I have level 1 tasks as categories and any
actionable items start at level 2.  So a project is any level 2 task
with actionable subtasks (any todo keyword)

I no longer spend any time deciding if something is a project or not.
If it has subtasks and is worth doing it's a project.  If it's not worth
doing I just cancel it and move on.

HTH,
Bernt

GTD: Tags or Custom TODO states?

[Matt Price]

On Sun, Jun 20, 2010 at 11:58 AM, Bernt Hansen <bernt@norang.ca> wrote:
> Matt Price <moptop99@gmail.com> writes:

>> GTD.org
>> this is the main storage place for actionable items, and items that
>> are waiting for a response, so it is listed in the agenda-files alist.
>>  My plan is to use custom agenda views to quickly access all actions i
>> need to take and all items i'm waiting for.  Everything should be
>> tagged with at least   a CONTEXT tag (calls, emails, office, home,
>> errands, etc) and in most cases probably another tag that relates in
>> some ways to content -- so e.g. a person's name could be used as a tag
>> to build what Allen calls "agendas" for the next meeting you have with
>> that person.  limiting on tags should make that pretty
>> straightforward.  Everything should also have a TODO state associated
>> with it; right now I'm thinking something like this:
>> TODO WAITING |DONE
>> but maybe there should be others.  (i do want to keep things as simple
>> as possible, though)
>
> With org-mode there's no real reason you have to keep these all in a
> single file.  I use multiple files with org-agenda-files listing the
> active ones which will contribute tasks to my agenda.

i'll see how it goes with one file -- i'm really loving having all my
mail in one folder and just filtering with wanderlust, i'm hoping it
will be the same with this system.
>
>>
>> Projects.org
>
> I've tried multiple things for projects:
>  - todo state keywords (PROJECT and PROJDONE)
>  - tags :project:
>
> and I've recently moved to a lazy project definition described at
> http://doc.norang.ca/org-mode.html#sec-12_2

right now i'm using both tags and custom todo states, until i decide
which one works better.  i think i want to use todo states -- but i'm
having trouble filtering on TODO in the agenda, hopefully i'll figure
that out soon.
>
> This works great for me since I have level 1 tasks as categories and any
> actionable items start at level 2.  So a project is any level 2 task
> with actionable subtasks (any todo keyword)

i am thinking of something like that. there are 2 todo sequences:
PROJECT SOMEDAY MAYBE COMPLETED
ACTION WAITING BLOCKED DONE
only things that are actually actionable get called "actions" and end
up in my daily list of things to do.

anyway thanks for this, still working out the kinks but enjoying the system.

Re: GTD: Tags or Custom TODO states?

[Jonathan Arkell]

On Jun 18, 2010, at 4:51 PM, Matt Price wrote:

> Hi Everyone,
>
> So, I'm going to try to implement David Allen's Getting Things Done
> using org-mode, as so many other people have done already.  I'd like
> to set things up more or less right the first time, but since GTD is
> brand-new to me (just finished the book today!) and I'm still only
> barely competent at org-mode, I'm a little anxious about the choices I
> need to make.  I think I understand some of the steps I have to take
> now, but would love some advice from all the GTD'ers out there.  So
> here goes:

Don't be anxious, just do it!  Imagine if I came to you and said:

"I'm going to try to make a 3d movie like Toy Story using (latest-and-greatest-3d-package-here), as so many people have done already.  I'd like to set things up more ore less right hte first time, but since 3d animation is brand-new to me, I'm a little anxious about the choices I need to make."

Start Simple.  Just get used to the todo state changes, and how they work, then maybe dive into org-remember (not too deep!  That whole thing is going through a re-write, so do just enough to get the job done!).  This will at least get you through the Collection phase of things.

Next up, learn about Refiling and how that works, then you've got the Process/Organize end of the equation sorted out.

After that, Learn about the Agenda--stuck projects in particular will be a BOON.  This will help you in the review cycle, not only weekly, but daily, and perhaps even the higher-level 20-50K feet reviews as your system matures.

But be prepared for the first draft of your system to be exactly that, a first draft.  You're just learning about org-mode **and** GTD, both of these things are deep and full of much mojo.  So 3 years from now, your approach to GTD, and implementation in org-mode are going to be radically different.

The thing about org-mode is that it starts as being a reasonably functional system out of the box for GTD, but hte more you take the time to learn it, the better you can customize it to make it **your** GTD implementation.

Bernt's Doc has been invaluable to my own implementation process.
http://doc.norang.ca/org-mode.html

Don't try to do EVERYTHING there, just pick and choose which features you feel you really need.

Cheers!

__________________________________

Jonathan Arkell
Tech Lead
Inspired By Drum & Bass, Scheme, Kawaii

p. 403.206.4377

402 -- 11th Ave SE
Calgary, AB, Canada T2G 0Y4

jonathana@criticalmass.com
criticalmass.com


The information contained in this message is confidential. It is intended to be read only by the individual or entity named above or their designee. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any distribution of this message, in any form, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and delete or destroy any copy of this message.

Re: GTD: Tags or Custom TODO states?

[Carsten Dominik]

On Jun 23, 2010, at 6:28 PM, Jonathan Arkell wrote:

> On Jun 18, 2010, at 4:51 PM, Matt Price wrote:
>
>> Hi Everyone,
>>
>> So, I'm going to try to implement David Allen's Getting Things Done
>> using org-mode, as so many other people have done already.  I'd like
>> to set things up more or less right the first time, but since GTD is
>> brand-new to me (just finished the book today!) and I'm still only
>> barely competent at org-mode, I'm a little anxious about the  
>> choices I
>> need to make.  I think I understand some of the steps I have to take
>> now, but would love some advice from all the GTD'ers out there.  So
>> here goes:
>
> Don't be anxious, just do it!  Imagine if I came to you and said:
>
> "I'm going to try to make a 3d movie like Toy Story using (latest- 
> and-greatest-3d-package-here), as so many people have done already.   
> I'd like to set things up more ore less right hte first time, but  
> since 3d animation is brand-new to me, I'm a little anxious about  
> the choices I need to make."
>
> Start Simple.  Just get used to the todo state changes, and how they  
> work, then maybe dive into org-remember (not too deep!  That whole  
> thing is going through a re-write, so do just enough to get the job  
> done!).  This will at least get you through the Collection phase of  
> things.
>
> Next up, learn about Refiling and how that works, then you've got  
> the Process/Organize end of the equation sorted out.
>
> After that, Learn about the Agenda--stuck projects in particular  
> will be a BOON.  This will help you in the review cycle, not only  
> weekly, but daily, and perhaps even the higher-level 20-50K feet  
> reviews as your system matures.
>
> But be prepared for the first draft of your system to be exactly  
> that, a first draft.  You're just learning about org-mode **and**  
> GTD, both of these things are deep and full of much mojo.  So 3  
> years from now, your approach to GTD, and implementation in org-mode  
> are going to be radically different.
>
> The thing about org-mode is that it starts as being a reasonably  
> functional system out of the box for GTD, but hte more you take the  
> time to learn it, the better you can customize it to make it  
> **your** GTD implementation.
>
> Bernt's Doc has been invaluable to my own implementation process.
> http://doc.norang.ca/org-mode.html
>
> Don't try to do EVERYTHING there, just pick and choose which  
> features you feel you really need.
>
> Cheers!

What a wonderful and true post, thanks Jonathan.

- Carsten

>
> __________________________________
>
> Jonathan Arkell
> Tech Lead
> Inspired By Drum & Bass, Scheme, Kawaii
>
> p. 403.206.4377
>
> 402 -- 11th Ave SE
> Calgary, AB, Canada T2G 0Y4
>
> jonathana@criticalmass.com
> criticalmass.com
>
>
> The information contained in this message is confidential. It is  
> intended to be read only by the individual or entity named above or  
> their designee. If the reader of this message is not the intended  
> recipient, you are hereby notified that any distribution of this  
> message, in any form, is strictly prohibited. If you have received  
> this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and  
> delete or destroy any copy of this message.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode

- Carsten

Re: GTD: Tags or Custom TODO states?

[Markus Heller]

On 6/23/2010 10:21 AM, Carsten Dominik wrote:
> On Jun 23, 2010, at 6:28 PM, Jonathan Arkell wrote:
>
>> On Jun 18, 2010, at 4:51 PM, Matt Price wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>
>>> So, I'm going to try to implement David Allen's Getting Things Done
>>> using org-mode, as so many other people have done already. I'd like
>>> to set things up more or less right the first time, but since GTD is
>>> brand-new to me (just finished the book today!) and I'm still only
>>> barely competent at org-mode, I'm a little anxious about the choices I
>>> need to make. I think I understand some of the steps I have to take
>>> now, but would love some advice from all the GTD'ers out there. So
>>> here goes:
>>
>> Don't be anxious, just do it! Imagine if I came to you and said:
>>
>> "I'm going to try to make a 3d movie like Toy Story using
>> (latest-and-greatest-3d-package-here), as so many people have done
>> already. I'd like to set things up more ore less right hte first time,
>> but since 3d animation is brand-new to me, I'm a little anxious about
>> the choices I need to make."
>>
>> Start Simple. Just get used to the todo state changes, and how they
>> work, then maybe dive into org-remember (not too deep! That whole
>> thing is going through a re-write, so do just enough to get the job
>> done!). This will at least get you through the Collection phase of
>> things.
>>
>> Next up, learn about Refiling and how that works, then you've got the
>> Process/Organize end of the equation sorted out.
>>
>> After that, Learn about the Agenda--stuck projects in particular will
>> be a BOON. This will help you in the review cycle, not only weekly,
>> but daily, and perhaps even the higher-level 20-50K feet reviews as
>> your system matures.
>>
>> But be prepared for the first draft of your system to be exactly that,
>> a first draft. You're just learning about org-mode **and** GTD, both
>> of these things are deep and full of much mojo. So 3 years from now,
>> your approach to GTD, and implementation in org-mode are going to be
>> radically different.
>>
>> The thing about org-mode is that it starts as being a reasonably
>> functional system out of the box for GTD, but hte more you take the
>> time to learn it, the better you can customize it to make it **your**
>> GTD implementation.
>>
>> Bernt's Doc has been invaluable to my own implementation process.
>> http://doc.norang.ca/org-mode.html
>>
>> Don't try to do EVERYTHING there, just pick and choose which features
>> you feel you really need.
>>
>> Cheers!
>
> What a wonderful and true post, thanks Jonathan.
>
> - Carsten
>

I agree, and I especially second Jonathan's statement about Bernt's 
documentation.

Markus

>> __________________________________
>>
>> Jonathan Arkell
>> Tech Lead
>> Inspired By Drum & Bass, Scheme, Kawaii
>>
>> p. 403.206.4377
>>
>> 402 -- 11th Ave SE
>> Calgary, AB, Canada T2G 0Y4
>>
>> jonathana@criticalmass.com
>> criticalmass.com
>>
>>
>> The information contained in this message is confidential. It is
>> intended to be read only by the individual or entity named above or
>> their designee. If the reader of this message is not the intended
>> recipient, you are hereby notified that any distribution of this
>> message, in any form, is strictly prohibited. If you have received
>> this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and delete
>> or destroy any copy of this message.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
>> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
>> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
>> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
>
> - Carsten
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode
>

Re: GTD: Tags or Custom TODO states?

[Noorul Islam K M]

Jonathan Arkell <jonathana@criticalmass.com> writes:

>
> Bernt's Doc has been invaluable to my own implementation process.
> http://doc.norang.ca/org-mode.html
>

Indeed invaluable.

Thanks and Regards
Noorul