From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Olwe Melwasul Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Do we need a "Stevens" book? Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2010 11:42:14 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1280335373 460 80.91.229.12 (28 Jul 2010 16:42:53 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2010 16:42:53 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jul 28 18:42:52 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Oe9iV-0000ix-SA for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 28 Jul 2010 18:42:52 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50696 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Oe9iV-0003mq-4O for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 28 Jul 2010 12:42:51 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=51455 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Oe9i5-0003ml-Gh for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 28 Jul 2010 12:42:26 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Oe9i4-0004BA-Dr for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 28 Jul 2010 12:42:25 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-pz0-f41.google.com ([209.85.210.41]:35744) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Oe9i4-0004Aj-8f for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 28 Jul 2010 12:42:24 -0400 Original-Received: by pzk33 with SMTP id 33so4358695pzk.0 for ; Wed, 28 Jul 2010 09:42:22 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:received:date:message-id :subject:from:to:content-type; bh=FyxRLLv6bcOSWmQqFMRjoeqyIRGh5dUL2xuTgwMs3nQ=; b=KPsj5jAV3XQEv3MGyA92oHuw3ktCRJ5yIQ5FU1+EPqGsJoRMuIMDJgT6j3sqqYpvv3 +3j1AZYio05qAxsdUn3S+x7Wwm5DMGzclik5PE+TkBSs0vSFNenFyHeGrtMwSANFF84X XgbZTY+gOj2wNULmqGESQXP8PN1l6lWQlm0o8= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=QMQNBfhjE8lwoQAvTHhR5t3kRA2QEc76SPEPMByA1SUNuqk8zt6K+ZiNuZUzUXP21c Hn6z2NZlG2M9OMrNyvC5W9ikI7PDFnEPWWHXS1Ed1NoGNo65Jfgu4ectyeqoGaa2Xe15 hBMl84KKLuZ+KnAIkqvMdJdg/ig4x1YIszmp4= Original-Received: by 10.114.124.1 with SMTP id w1mr14550220wac.96.1280335341111; Wed, 28 Jul 2010 09:42:21 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.220.194.137 with HTTP; Wed, 28 Jul 2010 09:42:14 -0700 (PDT) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:74325 Archived-At: I've not gotten very far with this idea; no one seems interested, but I'll try it here anyway... It seems to me that Emacs needs a W. Richard Stevens-style book. As you may know, Stevens wrote the "Advanced Programming in the UNIX(R) Environment" textbook that many of us used in college. Or maybe Emacs needs something along the lines of the many "Linux gnarly/wooly internals" books. Anyway, I would love to see a book that got into the nitty-gritty of Emacs/elisp -- just like you see discussed here every day on the help-gnu-emacs list. Here's an example: comint. How do you effectively use comint? When should you use comint? Okay, I can Google around and find one-off blog discussions here and there about comint; I can read them all; I can get confused; I can kludge something together ... and then find out later that what I've done (as well as bloggers A, B, and C) is really not "best practice" use of comint, i.e., that how I've used comint is overkill or could have been done much simpler with .el. Wouldn't it be nice to have one go-to source/book that thrashed out comint usage once and for all? Just skimming through all the elisp material (books, Internet, etc.), it seems like a hodge-podge on a continuum between gems and junk just waiting for a clear-speaking Richard Stevens to whip it all into shape. Sure, the "official" texts will get you pretty far, but no way are you ready to be a "best-practices" guru. The printed books seem more like a "cookbook" than a real Stevens-style book. Maybe I'm all wrong, but I think I like what the Racket/PLT people are doing. They seem to be whipping the Scheme hodge-podge into a decent best-practices, best-tools order. Personally I've been admiring Emacs from afar for quite some time. I'm really an Emacs/elisp newbie, but I've got a writing/technical writing background. If what I'm saying strikes a chord, maybe I could be a receiver/collector of a "best-practices-slash-wooly internals" sorta book project. It would be a free/GNU sorta thing of course ... and please don't say "I don't think there'd be enough interest in it." Olwe