From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Lennart Borgman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Key bindings proposal Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2010 15:29:26 +0200 Message-ID: References: <19534.1494.627000.357123@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <19537.40472.267000.563053@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <176EDAD3B9E54E39870FA3F84A5DDF3C@us.oracle.com> <19542.56658.583000.394397@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <19544.1015.468000.280770@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <87lj8nsndb.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <19545.14451.62000.682223@gargle.gargle.HOWL> <87ocdiv7d8.fsf@home.jasonrumney.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1280928737 675 80.91.229.12 (4 Aug 2010 13:32:17 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2010 13:32:17 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Uday S Reddy , "Stephen J. Turnbull" , Drew Adams , joakim@verona.se, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Jason Rumney Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Aug 04 15:32:10 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Oge4l-0002Lg-3h for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 04 Aug 2010 15:32:07 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42930 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Oge4k-0000oA-Ed for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 04 Aug 2010 09:32:06 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=34204 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Oge2W-0008FU-BK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 04 Aug 2010 09:29:49 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Oge2V-0006NJ-2D for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 04 Aug 2010 09:29:48 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-qy0-f176.google.com ([209.85.216.176]:38053) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Oge2U-0006NB-Rd; Wed, 04 Aug 2010 09:29:47 -0400 Original-Received: by qyk34 with SMTP id 34so4156510qyk.0 for ; Wed, 04 Aug 2010 06:29:46 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:mime-version:received:in-reply-to :references:from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=r1KNxcHGerOcoS0vmcQn2yyP+GWn1NRGpPpjgF8J9js=; b=aqFa6RJxkNr7zUeRDuk2loC1hvYn+WCP/tmk1pwST2VAcZF70FrC4YbopsnJdYdexb LASZs4UCi0Oq6zCyatVKcTW84G/JVNV28ZkC5rmW1SpNWjQbRrHxxEBeMzHxbIgT3w0c LuxxeL8byXEfc8VH4v9Gg4JoPxftCoyzrP7zQ= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=gmYEpKvwvEt4kxds/lDuxzWGguVN4GiRVW9xpVFzybNcbTNfnnyAwe5nbQykRKfyfr NP9Z88QB2HNs9gAj97rIamCiDOwL2RxJHlPpvpzyLHG+0h77BTcDGvCiabnLjbtZ56KO FhiRo2Wrx1mYLM4D94ddf8sNRy4ifzgGQ/WNc= Original-Received: by 10.224.11.6 with SMTP id r6mr3189732qar.210.1280928586260; Wed, 04 Aug 2010 06:29:46 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.229.9.84 with HTTP; Wed, 4 Aug 2010 06:29:26 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87ocdiv7d8.fsf@home.jasonrumney.net> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:128239 Archived-At: On Wed, Aug 4, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Jason Rumney wrote: > Lennart Borgman writes: > >> In my patched version of Emacs on w32 you can use the left and/or >> right window keys as alt instead. >> >> Some people here has said that this is just as bad since that >> overrides the normal use of those keys. I do not agree for two >> reasons: >> >> - microsoft has made it possible to override those keys totally, while >> you can not totally override the alt key. >> - using the alt key is far more common than using the windows key. > > Your opinion differs from many people on both accounts. I think ms agree with me on both... > To override the Windows keys, you have had to use a low level keyboard > hook to catch the key before the normal Windows input event handling > takes place. =C2=A0This is required to catch about half a dozen bindings = that > Windows does not let you override in the officially supported way (which > is used by w32-register-hot-key). The low level keyboard hook is the only supported way as far as I know. There were other ways before, but I think ms dropped them since they were not secure. (Is not hot keys for a different situation?) > OTOH, the only Alt keybinding that requires such hackery is Alt-TAB. No. Alt-TAB can not be overrided by low level keyboard hooks on w32. That is stated in ms documentation. (I have sent links to this long ago.)