From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: christophe Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs vista build failures Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 07:14:27 +0200 Message-ID: <9e09ff30807202214s2710d1a3p68fbb99faa2423fd@mail.gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1216617308 16105 80.91.229.12 (21 Jul 2008 05:15:08 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 05:15:08 +0000 (UTC) Cc: lord@emf.net, rms@gnu.org, drobinow@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, acm@muc.de, miles@gnu.org To: hannes@saeurebad.de Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jul 21 07:15:56 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1KKnkV-0000ci-9i for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 07:15:51 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33676 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KKnjc-0007oP-40 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 01:14:56 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KKnjD-0007jd-3E for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 01:14:31 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KKnjB-0007jF-VC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 01:14:30 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=41742 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KKnjB-0007jA-Ow for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 01:14:29 -0400 Original-Received: from fg-out-1718.google.com ([72.14.220.154]:22923) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KKnjB-0008H2-BA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2008 01:14:29 -0400 Original-Received: by fg-out-1718.google.com with SMTP id l26so590885fgb.30 for ; Sun, 20 Jul 2008 22:14:27 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:sender :to:subject:cc:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding :content-disposition:x-google-sender-auth; bh=B/LIKZrVWeXmyPNiI68A8EDBtqytL5Ptm/xJShweCic=; b=D1AhqGdPrkzCML+o9fhED2Hui4++WiDQhSr/RMiveoYEWIEz0OrufZR5w15RMg2dF4 5puIZ9sufBlex6gqMGH9vROccrBCLlnUOZo1MJPzxDCf7QLpsSoXV/5Nf4B021nM65Ae ohQHBeACQg7/9SScs4fpAYKOiOfCNkMkfbgmM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:cc:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:x-google-sender-auth; b=ejGxZgez2QporgORpp+DSldoJKEYJmf83m3XMH4Gwlbe5Lpk54HhLoPB6jIz2dIecC jYHZYxx2/HAt3+aRto80fFejr8MAWlRzoMjn2s1JHwQ/KXldzV0UfQOL99CDrtyO3Iaa 4678L9iB3PWkaZtJR/Gj6EF2o3cpVEvmyky7Y= Original-Received: by 10.86.80.17 with SMTP id d17mr4299430fgb.24.1216617267352; Sun, 20 Jul 2008 22:14:27 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.86.97.17 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Jul 2008 22:14:27 -0700 (PDT) Content-Disposition: inline X-Google-Sender-Auth: 934829492edbde67 X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:101051 Archived-At: On Sun, Jul 20, 2008 at 10:37 PM, Johannes Weiner wr= ote: > ------------------------------ > Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 22:22:08 +0200 > From: Johannes Weiner > Subject: Re: Emacs vista build failures > To: rms@gnu.org > Cc: acm@muc.de, lord@emf.net, drobinow@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, > Miles Bader > Message-ID: <87ej5oz4pb.fsf@saeurebad.de> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii > > Richard M Stallman writes: > >> > That is good news, but the general problem remains >> > as far as I know. Has there been a general move towards >> > supporting the GNU configure and build specs? >> >> As far as I know (I don't hack on X, I just read the mailing list), = the >> entire build infrastructure was replaced, and you can now do >> "./configure ...; make" etc., and things work in the normal GNU >> style. >> >> We are miscommunicating. As regards X itself, I took for granted that >> that is what you meant. >> >> My question concerns looking beyond X to the free software community >> as a whole. Has there been a broader move towords supporting the GNU >> configure and build specs? > > Maybe you heard the term `autohell' once? People tend to forget about > political issues when they are just frustrated with the software. > > Hannes Conversely, it is difficult to spread our philosophy and reach out to new communities with tools not originally designed for them; it seems especially the case when they're unfortunately centred around technical issues rather than social change. There is a lot of emacs users in rails community; it would be nice if they could come here and thereby help the free software movement... I noted this last year with sadness on this blog post: http://www.zedshaw.com/rants/rails_is_a_ghetto.html =AB... Any experienced developer knows that autoconf configure files are a PAIN IN THE ASS to recreate. They almost always require special reconfigure calls, special m4 macros, or just time. You usually get them right, generate them once, and then leave them in your repository for all to use. To make it worse, Kevin actually wrote a supposed alternative to autoconf, and yet he doesn't know the most basic thing about autoconf...=BB. christophe.