From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Paul Eggert Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: `message' not outputting the newline "atomically" Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2019 17:20:56 -0700 Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department Message-ID: <9d07a8e2-7f9b-bbfa-b73e-0d7aee09b099@cs.ucla.edu> References: <83y31xr3aa.fsf@gnu.org> <26154872-1a5c-7302-0f32-b16aff8e0ae7@cs.ucla.edu> <83blytq90m.fsf@gnu.org> <95de57fb-ef8c-a65f-d3ca-4a9e7f0f38bc@cs.ucla.edu> <83a7ecquzb.fsf@gnu.org> <83tvckp5ni.fsf@gnu.org> <83r27op1wb.fsf@gnu.org> <60d1b05d-ef4c-252a-0626-8c69c103fdf0@cs.ucla.edu> <83o92rpk1g.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="191450"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.7.0 Cc: schwab@suse.de, larsi@gnus.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jun 22 02:21:09 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1heTmG-000ng8-Iu for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 22 Jun 2019 02:21:08 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38512 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1heTmF-00029W-4t for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 20:21:07 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:46521) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1heTmA-00029Q-JY for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 20:21:03 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1heTm9-0005Es-HZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 20:21:02 -0400 Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.68]:48410) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1heTm7-0005At-OD; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 20:20:59 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8E49161C41; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 17:20:57 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id lb-DU2o9CCEK; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 17:20:56 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAE5B161C47; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 17:20:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at zimbra.cs.ucla.edu Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id o5Zv8zRKn7l1; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 17:20:56 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from Penguin.CS.UCLA.EDU (Penguin.CS.UCLA.EDU [131.179.64.200]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 95A951617D8; Fri, 21 Jun 2019 17:20:56 -0700 (PDT) Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=eggert@cs.ucla.edu; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= xsFNBEyAcmQBEADAAyH2xoTu7ppG5D3a8FMZEon74dCvc4+q1XA2J2tBy2pwaTqfhpxxdGA9 Jj50UJ3PD4bSUEgN8tLZ0san47l5XTAFLi2456ciSl5m8sKaHlGdt9XmAAtmXqeZVIYX/UFS 96fDzf4xhEmm/y7LbYEPQdUdxu47xA5KhTYp5bltF3WYDz1Ygd7gx07Auwp7iw7eNvnoDTAl KAl8KYDZzbDNCQGEbpY3efZIvPdeI+FWQN4W+kghy+P6au6PrIIhYraeua7XDdb2LS1en3Ss mE3QjqfRqI/A2ue8JMwsvXe/WK38Ezs6x74iTaqI3AFH6ilAhDqpMnd/msSESNFt76DiO1ZK QMr9amVPknjfPmJISqdhgB1DlEdw34sROf6V8mZw0xfqT6PKE46LcFefzs0kbg4GORf8vjG2 Sf1tk5eU8MBiyN/bZ03bKNjNYMpODDQQwuP84kYLkX2wBxxMAhBxwbDVZudzxDZJ1C2VXujC OJVxq2kljBM9ETYuUGqd75AW2LXrLw6+MuIsHFAYAgRr7+KcwDgBAfwhPBYX34nSSiHlmLC+ KaHLeCLF5ZI2vKm3HEeCTtlOg7xZEONgwzL+fdKo+D6SoC8RRxJKs8a3sVfI4t6CnrQzvJbB n6gxdgCu5i29J1QCYrCYvql2UyFPAK+do99/1jOXT4m2836j1wARAQABzSBQYXVsIEVnZ2Vy dCA8ZWdnZXJ0QGNzLnVjbGEuZWR1PsLBfgQTAQIAKAUCTIByZAIbAwUJEswDAAYLCQgHAwIG FQgCCQoLBBYCAwECH In-Reply-To: <83o92rpk1g.fsf@gnu.org> Content-Language: en-US X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 131.179.128.68 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:238014 Archived-At: On 6/20/19 10:46 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> Every important Emacs stderr message ends in newline > So now we will have to enforce this all over the place It's already enforced, in the sense that (a) it's standard practice anyway, (b) a stderr diagnostic without a trailing newline is a bug since it'll mess up formatting for the next stderr diagnostic, and (c) POSIX allows platforms to line-buffer stderr by default and Emacs has been working on such platforms for ages anyway. If it helps, I can audit all uses of stderr in the Emacs source to see if any newlines are being omitted. Any such omissions are buggy anyway for reasons (a), (b), and (c), and this is true regardless of whether Emacs explicitly enables line-buffering for stderr. I would not be surprised to find one or two bugs in the hundreds of diagnostics that Emacs generates, but now is as good a time as any to fix any bugs that I find. > people don't expect stderr to be buffered Actually I expected stderr to be line-buffered, a behavior that POSIX allows and that I vaguely recall when running GNU code (sorry, don't remember what platforms). Evidently things are different in the milieu of MS-Windows as it does not support line-buffering; still, Emacs and other GNU programs have worked with line-buffered stderr for ages.