From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
To: Random832 <random832@fastmail.com>, emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: RE: ASCII-only startup message?
Date: Mon, 28 Dec 2015 02:09:03 -0800 (PST) [thread overview]
Message-ID: <9275c9dd-8a96-4011-8f43-817009103ea1@default> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <m2h9j3xgrb.fsf@fastmail.com>
> > So as the only demonstration of your claim that this character is
> > not maintained in Unicode for compatibility between "apostrophe"
> > and "right single quotation mark", you offer the statement that
> > the name is wrong.
>
> Drew Adams writes:
> > These are (should be) different animals and
> > they need not always have the same glyphs.
>
> As long as we're on the subject of whose claims are assertions without
> evidence, can you produce a single example of a system that actually
> supported using different glyphs for these (apart from the typewriter
> glyph, which isn't typographically appropriate for anything), and what
> those glyphs might have looked like?
I never made such a claim.
Not only have I not said that the glyphs need to be different
or have been different, I have explicitly said that the glyphs
can be the same even when the uses are different. They could
be (yes it's a choice) considered different characters based on
their different uses, and not on their different appearances.
What I have said is that an apostrophe is not a quotation mark.
They have different jobs. An apostrophe is used within a word.
Quotation marks are used around/between words.
Here is one linguist's interesting take, BTW: the apostrophe
is the 27th English letter!
The apostrophe is not a punctuation mark. It doesn't punctuate.
Punctuation marks are placed between units (sentences, clauses,
phrases, words, morphemes) to signal structure, boundaries, or
pauses. The apostrophe appears within words. It's a 27th letter
of the alphabet. This issue concerns spelling.
http://chronicle.com/blogs/linguafranca/2013/03/22/being-an-apostrophe/
and http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=2664
> And, lest we get off the subject, The reason not to use U+2019 or any
> other non-ASCII character in the default scratch buffer text is because
> the user may not be able to save it, not because the ASCII one is more
> typographically or semantically appropriate.
That is part of the argument I made more generally for ' (U+0027):
ease of use by users of a text editor and programming environment.
I am not the one arguing that it should be used because it is
more beautiful (though I don't personally think it is less
beautiful, in the default fonts and the fonts I use). Relative
beauty was given as a reason only by those in favor of U+2019.
I've been pretty clear that the reason to use it is to make
life easier for users - in several ways.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2015-12-28 10:09 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 62+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2015-12-26 17:25 ASCII-only startup message? Paul Eggert
2015-12-26 18:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-26 18:41 ` Random832
2015-12-26 18:50 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-26 19:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-26 19:01 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-26 18:45 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-26 19:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-26 19:40 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-26 20:50 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-26 23:28 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-27 0:17 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-27 1:03 ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2015-12-27 2:51 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-27 1:09 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-27 15:56 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-27 18:45 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-27 6:58 ` Random832
2015-12-27 14:17 ` Per Starbäck
2015-12-27 14:55 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-27 16:35 ` Per Starbäck
2015-12-27 17:42 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-27 19:27 ` Per Starbäck
2015-12-27 22:47 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-27 23:45 ` Per Starbäck
2015-12-28 2:01 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-28 5:51 ` Random832
2015-12-28 10:09 ` Drew Adams [this message]
2015-12-28 6:05 ` Per Starbäck
2015-12-28 10:13 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-28 9:12 ` Nikolai Weibull
2015-12-28 10:15 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-28 14:59 ` Nikolai Weibull
2015-12-28 18:39 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-29 9:06 ` Alan Mackenzie
2015-12-28 9:37 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-28 10:16 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-29 7:05 ` Random832
2015-12-29 8:01 ` Yuri Khan
2015-12-29 14:38 ` Random832
2015-12-29 15:58 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-29 17:05 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-29 18:00 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-29 18:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-29 19:24 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-29 15:55 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-29 17:40 ` Drew Adams
2015-12-28 16:31 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-27 3:44 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-12-27 8:12 ` Nikolai Weibull
2015-12-28 20:04 ` John Wiegley
2015-12-29 6:50 ` Richard Stallman
2015-12-29 16:55 ` John Wiegley
2015-12-29 17:30 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-29 18:18 ` Drew Adams
2016-01-01 13:29 ` Marcin Borkowski
2016-01-01 17:48 ` John Wiegley
2016-01-01 17:50 ` John Wiegley
2016-01-02 8:14 ` Paul Eggert
2015-12-29 15:05 ` Random832
2015-12-29 16:49 ` John Wiegley
[not found] ` <<n5u7gn$6vh$1@ger.gmane.org>
2015-12-29 17:46 ` Drew Adams
[not found] <<567ECD8C.1070408@cs.ucla.edu>
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