all messages for Emacs-related lists mirrored at yhetil.org
 help / color / mirror / code / Atom feed
From: "Mario Castelán Castro" <marioxcc.MT@yandex.com>
To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
Subject: Re: CVE-2017-14482 - Red Hat Customer Portal
Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2017 20:43:39 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <9146e66c-1055-0f61-f290-874e40377a76@yandex.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <86ing630vd.fsf@zoho.com>

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2143 bytes --]

On 25/09/17 16:49, Emanuel Berg wrote:
> Mario Castelán Castro wrote:
> 
>> This is the prevalent attitude among
>> programmers
> 
> Perhaps because it makes sense? It is known as
> "conventional wisdom".
> 
>> we are showered by an endless stream of
>> security patches and bug fixes.
> 
> Yes, and what is the problem with that?

Obviously each such fix is evidence that a security vulnerability or
another defect existed in the first place. A shower of fixes means that
bugs are extremely prevalent in software. Otherwise it would have been
impossible to sustain this tremendous bug discovery rate for years
(check any web front end to the CVE database for details).

Thus it is clear that the mainstream approach to writing software is
failing to delivers reliable software. That is why we have the need for
an alternative. Among all possible approaches, *only* formal testing has
the possibility of virtually eliminating software defects.

Note that errors in the model of the environment (as in the paper
previously mentioned in this conversation) are not a *consequence* of
formal verification. This is just a symptom, and moreover it is routine
in non-formally verified software (i.e.: the developers make assumptions
about the environment that will not always be met).

For example, in Linux[1] they use the -fno-strict-pointer-aliasing
compiler flag which is just a way to shove under the rug the problem of
some incorrect assumptions they make about the semantics of C. This is
an error of the implicit model of the environment. It is not stated in
formal logic, but it is an error nonetheless.

Formal verification provide a solution for this problem: If the low
level software that makes up the environment for high level software has
a formal specification, then the possibility of errors in the model of
the environment can be eliminated by using the pre-existing formal model
of the environment.

[1] I mean Linux, the *kernel* used in GNU/Linux and other OS.

-- 
Do not eat animals; respect them as you respect people.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=how+to+(become+OR+eat)+vegan


[-- Attachment #2: OpenPGP digital signature --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 228 bytes --]

  reply	other threads:[~2017-09-26  1:43 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 68+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2017-09-21 21:51 CVE-2017-14482 - Red Hat Customer Portal ken
2017-09-21 22:03 ` Kaushal Modi
2017-09-21 23:07   ` ken
2017-09-22  7:37     ` Alberto Luaces
2017-09-22  7:48       ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-22 20:12         ` Mario Castelán Castro
2017-09-22 22:14           ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-24  2:08             ` Mario Castelán Castro
     [not found]             ` <mailman.1063.1506218941.14750.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2017-09-24  6:47               ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-24 13:38                 ` Mario Castelán Castro
2017-09-24 14:42                   ` Óscar Fuentes
2017-09-24 14:54                     ` tomas
2017-09-26 18:57                       ` Narendra Joshi
2017-09-24 23:06                     ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-25 21:23                       ` Mario Castelán Castro
2017-09-25 21:49                         ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-26  1:43                           ` Mario Castelán Castro [this message]
2017-09-26  2:17                             ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-25 21:11                     ` Mario Castelán Castro
2017-09-25 23:58                       ` Óscar Fuentes
2017-09-26 14:46                         ` Mario Castelán Castro
2017-09-26 23:31                           ` Óscar Fuentes
2017-09-29 20:21                             ` Mario Castelán Castro
2017-09-29 12:43                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2017-09-29 14:59                             ` dekkzz78
2017-09-29 16:51                               ` Óscar Fuentes
2017-09-29 17:20                                 ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-29 18:27                                   ` Óscar Fuentes
2017-09-29 19:45                                     ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-29 20:06                                       ` Óscar Fuentes
2017-09-29 23:24                                         ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-29 18:03                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2017-09-24 23:07                   ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-23 10:05           ` Charles A. Roelli
2017-09-23 12:53             ` Óscar Fuentes
2017-09-23 13:12               ` Eli Zaretskii
2017-09-23 17:18                 ` Glenn Morris
2017-09-23 17:34                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2017-09-23 20:50                     ` Yuri Khan
2017-09-24  2:53                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2017-09-24  7:13                         ` Philipp Stephani
2017-09-24 18:29                           ` Robert Thorpe
2017-09-29  8:17                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2017-09-29 20:28                             ` Stefan Monnier
2017-09-29 23:28                               ` Emanuel Berg
2017-10-03  0:52                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2017-10-03  1:04                                   ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-29  7:11                           ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]                         ` <mailman.1068.1506237251.14750.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2017-09-24  7:48                           ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-25 21:26                         ` Glenn Morris
2017-09-25 22:02                           ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-25 22:08                           ` Ludwig, Mark
2017-09-26  5:50                             ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-26 13:40                               ` Ludwig, Mark
2017-09-26 17:46                             ` Philipp Stephani
2017-09-26 19:00                               ` Ludwig, Mark
2017-09-29 13:23                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2017-09-29  9:48                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2017-09-26 18:44                   ` Narendra Joshi
2017-09-26 18:51                     ` Philipp Stephani
     [not found]           ` <mailman.988.1506161159.14750.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2017-09-24  6:31             ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-22 16:40       ` ken
2017-09-22 19:07         ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-23 20:27     ` Bob Proulx
     [not found]     ` <mailman.1053.1506198486.14750.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2017-09-24  6:38       ` Emanuel Berg
2017-09-24 17:17         ` Maxim Cournoyer
2017-09-24 22:38           ` Emanuel Berg
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2017-09-27 10:51 Richard Melville

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=9146e66c-1055-0f61-f290-874e40377a76@yandex.com \
    --to=marioxcc.mt@yandex.com \
    --cc=help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this external index

	https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git
	https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git

This is an external index of several public inboxes,
see mirroring instructions on how to clone and mirror
all data and code used by this external index.