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From: A Soare <alinsoar@voila.fr>
To: "Lennart Borgman (gmail)" <lennart.borgman@gmail.com>
Cc: "Emacs   Dev  \[emacs-devel\]" <emacs-devel@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: Release plans
Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 15:37:22 +0200 (CEST)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <9119194.3603691218548242618.JavaMail.www@wwinf4615> (raw)



> 
> A Soare wrote:
> > 
> >> A Soare wrote:
> >>>>     Windows hardly matters anymore.
> >>>>
> >>>>     Windows is not growing much in functionality...
> >>>>
> >>>> Windows is important as a problem as long as it is non-free and
> >>>> considerable numbers of people keep using it.  It is clear that when
> >>>> you say it "hardly matters" you are thinking of some other criterion.
> >>> I have never known in all my life a person using windows that thought to use emacs. All persons that I knew and wanted to (learn lisp)/(use emacs) used linux or MAC OSX.
> >>>
> >>> So a considerable number of peuple use Windows, but (almost) never Emacs in Windows.
> >>
> >> What is your thoughts about that? Is there something to learn from it? 
> >> Is there something to investigate?
> >>
> > 
> > Quite so! Investing energy to develop it under Windows is (almost) loss of energy!
> 
> Yes, I understood that this is what you meant. But in what way did you 
> reach this conclusion?

By induction. I do not use Windows, and in linux I use emacs for lots of purposes.

> 
> 
> > I know a few cases of _good_ programmers at google, microsoft, etc that never thought to use emacs.
> > 
> > The reason: Windows has nicer environments to write C++, Delphi, C# etc. (that is what they told me).
> 
> Then how can it be good to develop Emacs under any operating system?

In Emacs under Linux for Linux!

> 
> 
> > That is what peuple does not like : to make effort to understand something that they can have without energy.
> 
> Don't you think that those programmers did invest quite a lot of effort 
> in understanding the software they are using now?

Friend and collegueas: yes, they had good marks at the faculty. They deposed much effort to learn.

> 
> 
> > Emacs and Linux is used just by peuple that wants to understand how things work.
> 
> Do you say that there is no use for Emacs?

In windows, yes, that is what I say. In Windows it is completely unuseful.

> 
> 
> > Windows is used by peuple that want to gain money and to arrive quiqkly at their purpose.
> 
> Do you say that using Emacs makes it take long time to do things?

It takes little time when you have already learned how to use it. The first time when you did a thing, you will never choose something different. Here is the point: the psychology. Peuple prefers never to make the first effort, and they prefer to use something to arrive quickly at the point.

> 
> 
> >>From all my experience (all what I saw), windows interface for emacs is as important as the file ./etc/sex.6 in emacs' sources.
> 
> Are you saying that this is the only part of Emacs that we should keep ;-)

Yes, Emacs in Linux is nice.




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             reply	other threads:[~2008-08-12 13:37 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 318+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-08-12 13:37 A Soare [this message]
2008-08-12 13:50 ` Release plans martin rudalics
2008-08-12 17:16   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-12 14:02 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 14:54 ` Paul R
2008-08-12 18:37 ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-08-12 19:16   ` Óscar Fuentes
2008-08-12 19:41     ` Paul R
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2008-08-14 15:36 Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-14 15:51 ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-14 21:00   ` Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-14 22:58     ` Johannes Weiner
     [not found] <SRV-ADEXCHyjlMFAVNL0000090e@waccglobal.org>
2008-08-13 14:07 ` Mike Rowse
2008-08-13  1:30 A Soare
2008-08-12 20:51 A Soare
2008-08-12 21:35 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 20:16 christophe
2008-08-12 18:57 A Soare
2008-08-12 18:54 A Soare
2008-08-12 18:58 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 18:41 A Soare
2008-08-12 18:46 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 18:55 ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-08-12 18:38 A Soare
2008-08-12 18:36 A Soare
2008-08-12 18:04 A Soare
2008-08-12 18:21 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 18:25   ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 15:34 A Soare
2008-08-12 15:59 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 14:34 A Soare
2008-08-12 14:52 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 17:14 ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-13  6:26   ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-13  9:20     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-14  5:19       ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-14  8:38         ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-14  9:33           ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-14  9:49             ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-08-14 10:04               ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-14 10:30                 ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-14 11:07                   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-14 11:44                     ` Tassilo Horn
2008-08-14 12:27                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-15 12:45                       ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-14 12:39                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-14 13:15                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-14 13:28                         ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-14 13:41                           ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-14 17:08                             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-14 14:30                         ` Gilaras Drakeson
2008-08-14 18:00                       ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-15 12:45                         ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-15 14:18                         ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-15 17:54                           ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-15 12:45                       ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-15 16:29                         ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-16 10:40                           ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-14 10:37                 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-08-14 11:24                   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-14 12:54                     ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-08-14 13:31                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-14 14:02                         ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-08-14 16:55                           ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-15 12:45                         ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-16  1:41                           ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-17  7:16                             ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-15  3:41                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-15  4:04                   ` Sean O'Rourke
2008-08-15 20:12                     ` Michael Ekstrand
2008-08-15  5:08                   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-16  0:08                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-16  5:14                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-15 17:20                   ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-16 10:39                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-16 12:05                       ` joakim
2008-08-17  7:16                         ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-17  9:32                           ` joakim
2008-08-18  6:14                             ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-18  7:19                               ` Tassilo Horn
2008-08-18  8:03                               ` Stefan Monnier
2008-08-18  8:26                               ` joakim
2008-08-19 12:21                                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-19 13:02                                   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-20  3:47                                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-20  5:20                                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-19 13:42                                   ` Tassilo Horn
2008-08-20  3:48                                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-18 14:20                               ` Gilaras Drakeson
2008-08-18 17:13                               ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-18 17:42                                 ` Paul R
2008-08-19 12:21                                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-20  0:01                                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-21 23:09                                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-16 16:29                       ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-16 21:04                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-16 21:35                         ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-16 22:43                           ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-17  7:31                             ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-18  0:01                               ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-18 10:18                                 ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-18 17:58                                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-18 21:09                                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-18 23:27                                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-19 10:23                                         ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-19 11:56                                           ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-19  9:46                                       ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-19 12:36                                         ` Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-20  5:55                                           ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-20 17:48                                             ` Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-25  1:34                                               ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-25 10:47                                                 ` Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-25 13:13                                                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-25 15:19                                                     ` Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-25 17:11                                                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-26  4:10                                                         ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-26 10:59                                                           ` Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-27  5:00                                                             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-27 11:37                                                               ` Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-28  5:42                                                                 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-28 10:17                                                                   ` Robert J. Chassell
2008-08-26 16:37                                                       ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-26 18:14                                                         ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-27 18:54                                                           ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-27 20:33                                                             ` Paul R
2008-08-29  2:41                                                               ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-29  5:34                                                                 ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-29 11:39                                                                   ` Bruce Stephens
2008-08-29 13:11                                                                     ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-29 19:23                                                                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-29 20:03                                                                         ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2008-08-29 20:20                                                                           ` Stefan Monnier
2008-08-29 20:53                                                                             ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-29 23:24                                                                               ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-29 22:56                                                                             ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-30 19:51                                                                             ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2008-08-30 23:07                                                                               ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-31  9:09                                                                                 ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2008-08-29 22:53                                                                           ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-31  9:27                                                                             ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2008-08-29 19:13                                                                     ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-29 23:48                                                                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-09-01  6:11                                                                   ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-09-01 18:25                                                                     ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-27 22:32                                                             ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-27 21:57                                                               ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-08-28  0:10                                                                 ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-29  2:40                                                                   ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-29  5:30                                                                     ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-27 22:09                                                               ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-28  1:10                                                                 ` Thomas Lord
2008-09-01  6:11                                                                   ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-09-01 18:09                                                                     ` Thomas Lord
2008-09-02  1:09                                                                       ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-09-02  2:18                                                                         ` Thomas Lord
2008-09-02 14:13                                                                           ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-09-02 20:48                                                                             ` Thomas Lord
2008-09-01 18:20                                                                     ` Stefan Monnier
2008-09-01 20:17                                                                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-09-01 19:53                                                                         ` Stefan Monnier
2008-09-01 21:23                                                                           ` Thomas Lord
2008-09-02  3:26                                                                         ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-09-02 20:43                                                                           ` Thomas Lord
2008-09-03  5:08                                                                             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-27 23:09                                                               ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-28  0:22                                                                 ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-28  1:01                                                                   ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-26 21:25                                                         ` joakim
2008-08-29  2:41                                                           ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-19 15:52                                         ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-25 14:39                                           ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-25 22:01                                             ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-25 22:19                                               ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-26  4:54                                               ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-26 10:02                                                 ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-27  5:38                                                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-27 21:06                                                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-27 21:12                                                       ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-28 20:01                                                         ` Sean Sieger
2008-08-28  6:07                                                       ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-27 15:57                                                 ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2008-08-27 18:33                                                   ` tomas
2008-08-28  6:09                                                     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-28  8:14                                                       ` tomas
2008-08-28  7:25                                                     ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-28  8:23                                                       ` tomas
2008-08-28  6:26                                                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-19 16:31                                         ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-20  3:47                                         ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-20  6:14                                           ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-19 12:21                                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-19 13:04                                       ` Paul R
2008-08-20  3:48                                         ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-17  2:37                           ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-17  8:01                             ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-17 17:42                               ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-17 21:07                                 ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-17 21:24                                   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-17 21:33                                     ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-08-17 22:31                                       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-18  3:06                                   ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-18  6:14                                   ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-17 21:45                                 ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2008-08-18  6:14                                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-18 17:09                                   ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-19 16:28                                   ` René Kyllingstad
2008-08-20  3:48                                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-17  7:16                           ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-15  3:41               ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-15 17:17                 ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-16 10:40                   ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-16  7:14                 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2008-08-14 17:24             ` Stefan Monnier
2008-08-15  3:41           ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-15 14:04             ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-15 16:35               ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-15 18:07                 ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-16 10:40               ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-16 10:40               ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-12 13:51 A Soare
2008-08-12 13:11 A Soare
2008-08-12 13:20 ` Juanma Barranquero
2008-08-12 15:54   ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-13  6:26     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-13  7:05       ` Johannes Weiner
2008-08-12 13:24 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 12:21 A Soare
2008-08-12 12:33 ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 13:42 ` Michael Ekstrand
2008-08-13  6:27   ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-13  7:14     ` Alex Ott
2008-08-12 14:45 ` Miles Bader
2008-08-12 14:56   ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-12 16:47   ` Drew Adams
2008-08-13 20:20     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-12 18:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-08-05  2:53 dhruva
2008-08-05  4:43 ` tomas
2008-08-05 21:48 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-07-31  9:54 dhruva
2008-07-31 22:01 ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-30  9:58 dhruva
2008-07-31  1:59 ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-31  9:30   ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-07-31 22:01     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-08-01 14:15       ` Frank Schmitt
2008-08-01 14:51         ` Miles Bader
2008-08-02  5:12         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-08-02  7:20           ` Frank Schmitt
2008-08-03  1:33             ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-03 11:38               ` Juanma Barranquero
2008-08-03 22:42                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-03 23:16                   ` Juanma Barranquero
2008-08-04 15:55                   ` Davi Leal
2008-08-05 21:48                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-12  4:48                   ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-12  7:30                     ` Miles Bader
2008-08-12 15:37                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-12 10:32                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-12 16:08                       ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-13 20:20                         ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-03 13:48               ` Nic
2008-08-03 22:42                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-01 15:31       ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-02  5:12         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-08-02 17:12           ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-02 23:46             ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-03  1:33             ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-03 18:01               ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-04 15:33                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-12  4:24               ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-12 10:32                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-12 16:12                   ` Thomas Lord
2008-08-03  1:33             ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-03 17:51               ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-04 15:33                 ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-04 19:08                   ` Alan Mackenzie
2008-08-05  8:05                     ` Richard M. Stallman
2008-08-01 17:39       ` Davi Leal
2008-08-02  5:12         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-14 15:07 Chong Yidong
2008-07-17  0:27 ` Juri Linkov
2008-07-17  6:41   ` David Kastrup
2008-07-21  4:49 ` Chong Yidong
2008-07-21  8:06   ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2008-07-21 13:32     ` Chong Yidong
2008-07-21 14:19       ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2008-07-23 20:52   ` Michael Albinus
2008-07-23 21:42     ` Chong Yidong
2008-07-26  7:39   ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-26 21:33     ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-27  3:22       ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-27 17:14         ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-27 19:14           ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-28 21:46             ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-29  3:12               ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-30  3:47                 ` Richard M Stallman
2008-07-30 17:33                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-28 13:43     ` Juri Linkov
2008-07-28 14:10       ` Chong Yidong
2008-07-28 14:33         ` Juri Linkov
2008-07-29 17:11           ` Chong Yidong
2008-07-29 17:54             ` Stefan Monnier
2008-07-29 15:21     ` Roland Winkler
2008-08-02 17:34     ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-08-09 18:29       ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-08-09 18:34         ` Juanma Barranquero
2008-08-09 19:06           ` Eli Zaretskii
2008-07-31  2:10   ` Bastien
2008-07-31  2:43     ` Chong Yidong
2008-07-31  8:06       ` Lennart Borgman (gmail)
2008-08-01  2:53         ` Bastien
2008-08-01 19:26 ` Jay Belanger
2008-08-01 19:32   ` Chong Yidong
2008-08-02 16:12     ` Jay Belanger
2008-08-02  4:08   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2008-08-02 17:30   ` Richard M Stallman
2008-08-05  4:04   ` Bill Wohler

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