From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: How to opt out of curly-quote spamming altogether? Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2015 10:06:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <8ef60519-6660-4743-9c82-1442ca039a5a@default> References: <55DB3788.5060505@cs.ucla.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1440436027 1828 80.91.229.3 (24 Aug 2015 17:07:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2015 17:07:07 +0000 (UTC) To: Paul Eggert , emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Aug 24 19:06:55 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCv-0002mi-Qd for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 19:06:53 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55625 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCu-0007G2-KN for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 13:06:52 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:59773) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCq-0007DS-Q7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 13:06:49 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCn-0003lv-JA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 13:06:48 -0400 Original-Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:28341) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZTvCn-0003l0-D1 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 13:06:45 -0400 Original-Received: from aserv0022.oracle.com (aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id t7OH6bXd021509 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 24 Aug 2015 17:06:38 GMT Original-Received: from userv0122.oracle.com (userv0122.oracle.com [156.151.31.75]) by aserv0022.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t7OH6bW9015751 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 24 Aug 2015 17:06:37 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0014.oracle.com (abhmp0014.oracle.com [141.146.116.20]) by userv0122.oracle.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t7OH6b6X001817; Mon, 24 Aug 2015 17:06:37 GMT In-Reply-To: <55DB3788.5060505@cs.ucla.edu> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9 (901082) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] X-Source-IP: aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.4.x-2.6.x [generic] X-Received-From: 156.151.31.81 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:189112 Archived-At: > > that option has no effect on the quotation style used in the > > manuals. >=20 > Correct. Display of info files is unaffected by the changes in > Emacs master over the past month or two. Info files use curved > quotes as of Emacs 24.5, due to a 2013 change in Texinfo, not in Emacs. Not good. Users should have control over this, or the previous behavior should be restored. It makes no sense for Emacs to impose curly quoting for inline code fragments. That doesn't make much sense for other programming contexts either. Why should Texinfo make such decisions about the doc for a particular product such as Emacs? This is truly a step backward. Wrt the argument that a 2013 Texinfo change forces Emacs's hand: I have Emacs builds that are much more recent than 2013, and which do not exhibit this breakage. Sounds to me like a cop-out, to blame this only on a Texinfo change. Hard to believe that Texinfo/makeinfo does not give builders any choice about the resulting characters. And Eli seems to make clear that Emacs _can_ still be built without curly quotes, "telling makeinfo not to produce Unicode characters there". If nothing else works, the doc should be built both ways, and users should be allowed to choose which presentation to use.