From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Steven Tamm Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: macos.texi updated Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 23:12:43 -0700 Message-ID: <8C0A68AE-EF12-4D6C-9879-D0FF3B04DE1B@mac.com> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v734) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1127370701 25912 80.91.229.2 (22 Sep 2005 06:31:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 06:31:41 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 22 08:31:37 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EIKbR-0007v7-2n for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 22 Sep 2005 08:30:41 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EIKbP-0007Mi-Le for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:30:39 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1EIKPT-0004uc-MK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:18:19 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1EIKPQ-0004tC-Gi for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:18:17 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EIKPQ-0004le-0a for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:18:16 -0400 Original-Received: from [17.250.248.71] (helo=smtpout.mac.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1EIKK7-0006Mu-3n for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 22 Sep 2005 02:12:47 -0400 Original-Received: from mac.com (smtpin04-en2 [10.13.10.149]) by smtpout.mac.com (Xserve/8.12.11/smtpout14/MantshX 4.0) with ESMTP id j8M6CkAY012484; Wed, 21 Sep 2005 23:12:46 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [10.0.1.201] (c-69-181-198-51.hsd1.ca.comcast.net [69.181.198.51]) (authenticated bits=0) by mac.com (Xserve/smtpin04/MantshX 4.0) with ESMTP id j8M6ChTB023465; Wed, 21 Sep 2005 23:12:45 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Original-To: YAMAMOTO Mitsuharu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:43143 Archived-At: To correctly use ATSUI, the way that fonts are cached and handled would have to change. The cost of creating an ATSUStyle structure is ridiculously high and a new caching system would have to be added to maintain performance. Furthermore, the calculations of line height and character width are more difficult to perform because of fractional character widths and the rounding errors was leaving artifacts all over the screen. I was also trying to maintain backwards compatibility of old XLFDs, which I'm starting to think was unwise. I've made two attempts at implementing an ATSUI based drawing engine, and I couldn't get it to work right. It would probably be easier to graft on the parts of the Aqua (sic) port into the font/calculation/drawing portions than to convert from QDText to ATSU. Unless someone has the time or the inclination to implement ATSU and pretty much rewrite the font calculation portions of macterm. -Steven On Sep 21, 2005, at 1:21 AM, YAMAMOTO Mitsuharu wrote: > I've updated man/macos.texi. According to admin/FOR-RELEASE, it is > subject to proofreading by at least two persons before release. > Because this is my first time to edit Texinfo files, there may be some > "texi"cal and grammatical errors. Corrections of such errors are > also appreciated. > > BTW, there seems to be (sometimes loud) complaints about the use of > QuickDraw Text and XLFD for Carbon Emacs here and there. So let me > say something about their backgrounds. > > First, when I started the implementation of Central European and > Cyrillic display support by QuickDraw Text, I already knew that Steven > Tamm was working on ATSUI support and he was planning to add it to the > emacs-unicode-2 branch (actually I suggested that). As I expected, > the implementation by QuickDraw Text was completed much earlier than > ATSUI support (that's natural because most of the parts could be > reused), and more importantly, displayable characters were increased > without losing stability. If it had not been implemented, Carbon > Emacs could not display characters other than Mac Roman and CJK ones > still now without installing additional fonts. > > Second, I think the evacuation from XLFD for Carbon Emacs is a bad > idea at least for Emacs 22 for the following reason. In the Emacs 20 > era, the face support code was window-system dependent: there were > xfaces.c and w32faces.c, and "Emacs on Aqua" also has nsfaces.m. The > evacuation from XLFD for non-X11 ports might be meaningful for this > version. However, the situation has changed in Emacs 21. The face > support code has been much enhanced (35KB -> 209KB) and become > window-system independent: we only have xfaces.c and the Carbon port > as well as the W32 port is using it. Since XLFD is used throughout > xfaces.c, introducing another representation for fonts in the Carbon > port not only increases reimplementation work, but also has danger of > losing some functionality that is already implemented in other > systems. Of course, maintenance of code would also become more > difficult. So the use of XLFD is not a detour for Carbon Emacs. > > YAMAMOTO Mitsuharu > mituharu@math.s.chiba-u.ac.jp > > > _______________________________________________ > Emacs-devel mailing list > Emacs-devel@gnu.org > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-devel >