From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Tassilo Horn Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Scratch buffer annoyance Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:50:24 +0200 Message-ID: <87zm1vowqn.fsf@baldur.tsdh.de> References: <877ipev1iv.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87lkdhqp94.fsf@red-bean.com> <20070716203244.85A0A30116@Psilocybe.Update.UU.SE> <8ACF1129-2D04-4157-83F8-0F0F8928A5D2@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1184687448 1246 80.91.229.12 (17 Jul 2007 15:50:48 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 15:50:48 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jul 17 17:50:47 2007 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1IApK1-0002O6-IN for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:50:45 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IApK1-0002GY-4C for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:50:45 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1IApJy-0002GO-K4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:50:42 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1IApJx-0002GC-64 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:50:41 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IApJw-0002G9-Tc for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:50:40 -0400 Original-Received: from main.gmane.org ([80.91.229.2] helo=ciao.gmane.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1IApJw-0008Kw-Bp for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:50:40 -0400 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1IApJr-0004oZ-Nm for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:50:35 +0200 Original-Received: from dslb-084-063-059-145.pools.arcor-ip.net ([84.63.59.145]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:50:35 +0200 Original-Received: from tassilo by dslb-084-063-059-145.pools.arcor-ip.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Tue, 17 Jul 2007 17:50:35 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 59 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: dslb-084-063-059-145.pools.arcor-ip.net Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAAD1BMVEU8PDyjo6P5+fm+v8F/ gIO4imEzAAAACXBIWXMAAArrAAAK6wGCiw1aAAAATnRFWHRSYXcgcHJvZmlsZSB0eXBlIGV4aWYA CmV4aWYKICAgICAgMjAKNDU3ODY5NjYwMDAwNGQ0ZDAwMmEwMDAwMDAwODAwMDAwMDAwMDAwMAqJ uBZbAAAACXZwQWcAAAAwAAAAMADO7oxXAAABnklEQVQ4y6WU0YGDIAyGozIAFAY4iAM0iQNAZf+Z LkBrr1f7cseDIp8JyZ8ApA8D/gaiI/9cQne5A6wAcJCYwcwdIEEbbqyH/tGBZHjZ6apgbuALgF/2 XQfArK826CB5gGGA3gUNr9taMApkGLQIbIYeatRNQVcaiBbgCG6ADRadu77aqJo07w3M3W0bdQIo /a+HBQ4/pT1Y/2pRhZaeNTsRBTvlAlPMD6C+kS2UIEvZN7hnHsckwkT+koyjh1ZxTK5QZPdozEWl W7qIum60CJVMIcnGX7um0DWbVIy6Wc+ca6WeGHTNluTIiBNJa65yO0oLN/Q0sTAjglExj2ZglOvC CZNgzvUHQJE8tSIThzTqcy+qBFN6TTz9bB+kAE5rtBo2ifkJKM+roIK8EOPlAGg1GWFJuAEz3V5a tAHxuDmXf/WuZ4w7Ct1b5gmcYJo1ujcQVahNMxf7+xgUlnXHYOYTwMGY/HZwnIalnuobiF4VoxOL VCQ++vsVRKfBLmfA+O3UIgXv8ilIJcD5OQ92PgcrfLgZvvKnK2P9zyXzDWhiiUxowX0ZAAAAGnpU WHRqcGVnOmNvbG9yc3BhY2UAAHjaMwIAADMAM4k4IzUAAAAmelRYdGpwZWc6c2FtcGxpbmctZmFj dG9yAAB42jOqMNIxrDAEYQARgwLpPZcvTwAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== User-Agent: Gnus/5.110007 (No Gnus v0.7) Emacs/22.1.50 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:R52SKZAjGnBjutiTG43JEbFQn0A= X-detected-kernel: Linux 2.6, seldom 2.4 (older, 4) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:74992 Archived-At: David Reitter writes: > On 17 Jul 2007, at 16:05, Richard Stallman wrote: > >> Wouldn't it be smarter to make the initial splash screen the >> current buffer when Emacs starts instead? It would make sense >> for that to be read-only, and when one does C-x C-q, it could for >> example clear it and toggle the read-only status of the buffer >> (with a brief note in the initial splash screen that one can do >> C-x C-q to convert it into a "scratch" buffer). >> >> It is an interesting idea. What do others think? > > This will make Emacs even more difficult to use for new or occasional > users. They would need to know a key combination just to get started. > And it would be much more annoying than the current situation. Then all users that like the scratch buffer as it is right now would need to `C-x C-q' on startup. And what if you don't want the splash-screen at all? So I like David's idea better. > What's wrong with > > - automatically saving *scratch* in a place other than ~/ (where it is > out of the way) via auto-save and before exiting Emacs, without any > user interaction Yes, something like ~/.emacs.d/scratch would make sense. > - automatically restoring *scratch* from that file upon startup > (i.e. making it persistent) That would be very nice. Deleting the buffers contents is easy whereas losing important scratched down work when mindlessly closing emacs is very annoying. > - not offering to save it anywhere else (even though users may to C-x > C-w and save it, thereby converting it to a normal, non-persistent > buffer, and creating an empty *scratch* buffer automatically). And I would enable auto-saving for it, too. > This would preserve the equivalence to a real-life scratch paper that > one keeps on one's desk, which will not magically disappear overnight, > but which may be filed somewhere else when needed. I agree. > Oh, and it should be in text-mode, because most users will not want to > hack Elisp. Probably, but I think it would be good if the mode was specified by a variable, e.g. `scratch-buffer-mode' which defaulted to text-mode. So users could easily configure what mode they want to use. Bye, Tassilo