From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Emanuel Berg Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: if vs. when vs. and: style question Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2015 04:54:05 +0100 Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server Message-ID: <87zj6zw0wy.fsf@debian.uxu> References: <87sicvwckx.fsf@wmi.amu.edu.pl> <87wq27yvqg.fsf@debian.uxu> <8d531e99-7260-4263-ac99-09c6871e2708@googlegroups.com> <87vbhq53lf.fsf@debian.uxu> <87a8z23p23.fsf@kuiper.lan.informatimago.com> <87lhilx0cf.fsf@debian.uxu> <87twx9360u.fsf@kuiper.lan.informatimago.com> <0d1d19ab-06e9-462d-8867-9a49b1e232d3@googlegroups.com> <87lhil2io1.fsf@kuiper.lan.informatimago.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1427428220 2869 80.91.229.3 (27 Mar 2015 03:50:20 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2015 03:50:20 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Mar 27 04:50:20 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1YbLHn-0000zq-A9 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Fri, 27 Mar 2015 04:50:19 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:47495 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YbLHm-0005KT-0x for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 26 Mar 2015 23:50:18 -0400 Original-Path: usenet.stanford.edu!goblin2!goblin.stu.neva.ru!aioe.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail Original-Newsgroups: gnu.emacs.help Original-Lines: 51 Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: feB02bRejf23rfBm51Mt7Q.user.speranza.aioe.org Original-X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.4 (gnu/linux) X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.8.2 Cancel-Lock: sha1:JWLuZp61o7KdlTSj9Oamz48v3q8= Mail-Copies-To: never Original-Xref: usenet.stanford.edu gnu.emacs.help:211093 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:103375 Archived-At: It is not a big deal to insert Unicode chars compared to doing things in general, like carving a mud cake out the rear wheel of a bike. But compared to just hitting the familiar keys on the keyboard to insert the familiar ASCII, it is very slow. Which is even more frustrating because doing so doesn't add anything. Again, it is just like the way natural writing evolved. The first humans who wrote did a small picture of a house, i.e. a house icon, to signify a house. This practice was gradually abandoned because it lacked flexibility, convenience, and speed. Instead mankind went for the phonetic system were letters indicate sounds, then you combine them into words. However, after spending a lifetime reading and writing, to us it has come to full circle and the phonetic letter/sound system of word formation has come back to the iconic state. We don't *read* "house", we see it. Compared to seeing a picture of a house, it might be 50/50 which faster does communicate the meaning. But let's say: "The big house is green." How do you do that with images? Do you put the image for "big" - ...how do you draw that? - besides the house icon, and then add a green box? Or do you draw one big, green house? How do you know you are not supposed to look at the blue sky and white clouds behind it? It is exactly the same way with ASCII. We have had hundreds and thousands of hours reading and writing it. It doesn't matter some Unicode chars are clearer if compared to the ASCII combination in isolation. They are not clearer to the people who have never used them, and aren't about to start, either. Just as in the discussion (1+ data) vs. (+ 1 data) the context - which here is: history, custom, and experience - and not the properties of the things compared, is the answer. With computers it is ASCII. On university whiteboards anyone can draw whatever chars anyone likes. I'm not saying, "Stop doing that, use ASCII instead", am I? So the university people should perhaps stick to their whiteboards as well! -- underground experts united http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573