From: phillip.lord@russet.org.uk (Phillip Lord)
To: Alain Schneble <a.s@realize.ch>
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>,
monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: [Emacs-diffs] feature/integrated-elpa 4f6df43 15/23: README added
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 10:15:01 +0100 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <87zim747hm.fsf@russet.org.uk> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <m2y41rkhlw.fsf@newartisans.com> (John Wiegley's message of "Thu, 13 Oct 2016 15:29:47 -0700")
John Wiegley <jwiegley@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>> "AS" == Alain Schneble <a.s@realize.ch> writes:
>
> AS> /usr/local/share/info/org.info.gz
> AS> /usr/local/share/emacs/26.0.50/etc/ORG-NEWS
> AS> /usr/local/share/emacs/26.0.50/etc/org/README
> AS> /usr/local/share/emacs/26.0.50/etc/org/.*\.xml
> AS> /usr/local/share/emacs/26.0.50/etc/refcards/orgcard.tex
> AS> /usr/local/share/emacs/26.0.50/lisp/org/.*\.(el\.gz|elc)
>
> AS> Unless I'm misundarstanding you, using your approach, all files will end
> AS> up in /usr/local/share/emacs/26.0.50/lisp/org (using the example
> AS> configuration I gave above).
>
> AS> Do you really want to give up this standard file structure?
>
> I think we should *not* give up the standard file structure. At least not now.
> Using ELPA should feel "first class" for those authors contributing packages
> that are to become part of the standard distribution.
>
> Perhaps in future, for the sake of ease-of-upgrading, we'd want to change this
> policy, but one thing at a time.
It's worth considering what ease-of-upgrading means. At the moment, for
example, if I install org-mode with ELPA package.el generates all the
autoloads for org-mode and sticks them into a file. All is good.
But the old autoloads are still there, stuck in loaddefs.el in non-user
space, non-removable or changable. Functions that are in the
/usr/share/emacs installation but NOT in the ~/.emacs.d/elpa
installation will remain autoloaded, even though they should not be.
If org mode were it's own directory, with it's own org-autoloads.el,
then package.el could (and already does I believe) just not autoload any
of the functions from the old version of org-mode, nor put any of its
files into load-path.
It seems to me that one of the major use cases for adding core/tarball
ELPA support is enable packages to be present by default in an Emacs
tarball download, while still allowing upgrading from ELPA (or the
org-mode repo).
I cannot see how to address this using the "copy files from ELPA into
core" build, at least not with significant replumbing of the current
emacs build; perhaps someone else can, but it is worth considering this
when thinking about the valid but generic concerns I am hearing about
change.
Phil
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2016-10-14 9:15 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 204+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <20160916203414.25203.87032@vcs.savannah.gnu.org>
[not found] ` <20160916203416.8DF2F220166@vcs.savannah.gnu.org>
2016-09-16 22:43 ` [Emacs-diffs] feature/integrated-elpa 4f6df43 15/23: README added Stefan Monnier
2016-09-17 7:41 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-17 16:00 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-09-17 21:25 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-18 16:15 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-09-18 18:33 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-17 21:52 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-18 13:30 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-09-18 18:36 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-18 19:45 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-18 22:59 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-09-19 8:48 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-19 14:11 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-09-19 16:00 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-19 16:36 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-09-21 20:26 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-22 12:54 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-22 15:19 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-23 14:55 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-23 16:31 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-26 16:28 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-26 19:05 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-09-27 16:01 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-28 15:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-09-29 9:00 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-29 15:14 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-09-29 16:38 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-30 10:43 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-30 11:20 ` Alain Schneble
2016-09-30 12:39 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-30 11:56 ` Alain Schneble
2016-09-30 12:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-09-30 12:41 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-30 13:24 ` Alain Schneble
2016-09-30 16:17 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-30 20:02 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-03 12:32 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-03 16:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-05 6:28 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-05 15:23 ` Drew Adams
2016-10-07 16:15 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-08 14:58 ` Drew Adams
2016-10-09 20:30 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-07 16:11 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-08 10:43 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-09 20:17 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-08 14:58 ` Drew Adams
2016-10-08 17:35 ` Colin Baxter
2016-10-09 20:20 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-09 20:19 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-09 21:35 ` Drew Adams
2016-10-12 14:02 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-12 15:24 ` Drew Adams
2016-10-08 19:40 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-09 20:25 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-10 3:03 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-12 13:53 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-12 16:29 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-13 10:40 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-13 17:14 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-13 18:21 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-10-13 18:48 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-14 8:11 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-05 7:25 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-07 16:29 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-08 10:01 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-08 10:57 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-08 11:21 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-08 11:41 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-08 12:04 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-08 13:33 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-08 14:31 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-09 20:42 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-10 6:27 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-12 14:07 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-12 16:30 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-13 10:47 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-13 17:14 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-13 21:54 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-13 22:09 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-13 22:29 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-14 6:55 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-14 8:25 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-14 9:55 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-15 17:41 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-15 18:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-14 8:23 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-14 9:15 ` Phillip Lord [this message]
2016-10-14 8:20 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-14 8:49 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-14 9:25 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-14 9:52 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-14 13:51 ` Andy Moreton
2016-10-14 14:13 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-14 15:12 ` Andy Moreton
2016-10-14 15:22 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-14 16:47 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-15 12:01 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-15 12:22 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-15 13:34 ` Achim Gratz
2016-10-15 14:33 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-15 14:53 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-15 15:21 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 10:52 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 11:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 13:33 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 14:47 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 16:43 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 17:36 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 18:48 ` Achim Gratz
2016-10-18 19:15 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 7:51 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-19 8:28 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 9:31 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 9:42 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 9:51 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 10:25 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 15:19 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-19 19:21 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 20:24 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-19 20:57 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 22:35 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-20 9:42 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-20 7:22 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 15:14 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-19 17:59 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 15:09 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-19 15:26 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 16:12 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-19 17:40 ` Ted Zlatanov
2016-10-19 18:59 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-10-19 19:57 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-19 20:32 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-10-19 22:38 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-20 7:25 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 20:41 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-10-19 21:17 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 21:25 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2016-10-20 10:01 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 22:52 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-20 18:05 ` Achim Gratz
2016-10-19 18:04 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 19:47 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-20 7:21 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 18:26 ` Achim Gratz
2016-10-19 18:51 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 19:24 ` Achim Gratz
2016-10-19 20:13 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-20 7:17 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-20 6:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 19:33 ` Alain Schneble
2016-10-19 20:13 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-19 21:56 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-19 23:03 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-20 8:35 ` Michael Albinus
2016-10-20 6:35 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-15 17:18 ` Achim Gratz
2016-10-18 10:54 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 18:54 ` Achim Gratz
2016-10-19 8:01 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-15 17:08 ` Achim Gratz
2016-10-15 17:18 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 10:59 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 11:12 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 13:37 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 14:48 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 14:59 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-17 23:09 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-18 6:09 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 13:01 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 14:54 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-18 16:59 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 17:46 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-19 7:54 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 18:08 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-19 7:59 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-18 14:04 ` Andy Moreton
2016-10-15 11:51 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-15 12:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-15 11:48 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-09 20:38 ` [Emacs-diffs] " Phillip Lord
2016-10-10 6:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-10-08 10:25 ` Alain Schneble
2016-09-30 13:29 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-09-30 12:17 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-09-30 13:06 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-30 13:33 ` Eli Zaretskii
2016-09-30 16:22 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-30 17:30 ` John Wiegley
2016-10-03 12:33 ` Phillip Lord
2016-10-03 16:13 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-29 16:53 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-29 17:06 ` Drew Adams
2016-09-29 17:13 ` John Wiegley
2016-09-30 10:49 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-30 14:20 ` Drew Adams
2016-09-30 16:25 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-30 10:44 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-21 20:42 ` Clément Pit--Claudel
2016-09-22 12:49 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-22 17:43 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-09-23 14:49 ` Phillip Lord
2016-09-23 15:36 ` Stefan Monnier
2016-09-26 16:23 ` Phillip Lord
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