From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Philip Kaludercic Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Unboxed package manager Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2023 15:25:11 +0000 Message-ID: <87zg87saw8.fsf@posteo.net> References: <57668895-8EEA-44F7-BD46-9CDFAA11FD2C@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="23628"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Yuan Fu , emacs-devel To: Lynn Winebarger Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Mar 20 16:26:11 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1peHOk-0005rz-Ch for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2023 16:26:10 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1peHNy-0005IE-CA; Mon, 20 Mar 2023 11:25:22 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1peHNw-0005Hz-TD for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2023 11:25:20 -0400 Original-Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1peHNv-0006EY-5C for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2023 11:25:20 -0400 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0B0CD240285 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2023 16:25:12 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1679325915; bh=rPbtyN2odKzQEKqxdL+rrnD8C+G+0Nz0fiy4srMq3AQ=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Autocrypt:Date:From; b=V/Ip0OYpUaI6qAsKJrj2i/dYo/pF6vGnQFUwkqPVwtHOOV2sEF8vsR7jLnWboLHOC J8KtdNqtxiIFcTQKv3kCPXDsKO42NUtaCDaVWcrtDIyT/maEiisVoUFLjiuhK0p2wa RsQV6MXo1QjxbaGSLq7UMzdDLN02ezRXeJ7cWK5i9CA+FAY5yYVRnL9pciKSRUamo+ L2RWpFRvvG7TeGutXSskBxvLuvLvHxWiyl7iobDmq2sMyyN5RCivLnIOaKPCm3bJ51 U2v6wSvTMANU65psys8Oih2A9Z5udh9tw7Kl7O1MfxrLT06FN8Ea1D08VTl3uNxgmu I0ORADcapNNFQ== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4PgJT361Znz6tm4; Mon, 20 Mar 2023 16:25:11 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: (Lynn Winebarger's message of "Mon, 20 Mar 2023 05:09:00 -0400") Autocrypt: addr=philipk@posteo.net; keydata= mDMEZBBQQhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAHJuofBrfqFh12uQu0Yi7mrl525F28eTmwUDflFNmdui0QlBo aWxpcCBLYWx1ZGVyY2ljIChnZW5lcmF0ZWQgYnkgYXV0b2NyeXB0LmVsKSA8cGhpbGlwa0Bwb3N0 ZW8ubmV0PoiWBBMWCAA+FiEEDg7HY17ghYlni8XN8xYDWXahwukFAmQQUEICGwMFCQHhM4AFCwkI BwIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQ8xYDWXahwulikAEA77hloUiSrXgFkUVJhlKBpLCHUjA0 mWZ9j9w5d08+jVwBAK6c4iGP7j+/PhbkxaEKa4V3MzIl7zJkcNNjHCXmvFcEuDgEZBBQQhIKKwYB BAGXVQEFAQEHQI5NLiLRjZy3OfSt1dhCmFyn+fN/QKELUYQetiaoe+MMAwEIB4h+BBgWCAAmFiEE Dg7HY17ghYlni8XN8xYDWXahwukFAmQQUEICGwwFCQHhM4AACgkQ8xYDWXahwukm+wEA8cml4JpK NeAu65rg+auKrPOP6TP/4YWRCTIvuYDm0joBALw98AMz7/qMHvSCeU/hw9PL6u6R2EScxtpKnWof z4oM Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=philipk@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:304604 Archived-At: Lynn Winebarger writes: > On Mon, Mar 20, 2023, 4:55 AM Lynn Winebarger wrote: > >> On Mon, Mar 20, 2023, 2:31 AM Yuan Fu wrote: >> >>> > On Mar 19, 2023, at 6:18 PM, Lynn Winebarger >>> wrote: >>> > >>> > I've >>> > done this manually on various systems I use with a significant >>> > improvement in startup performance. >>> >>> It'll be interesting to see the numbers on the improvement. How much does >>> it improve startup time if there is x packages and y are loaded at startup >>> time? >> >> Good question. The systems I've done this manually on are one-off builds >> of 28.x on sandboxed systems where the system emacs is 24.3. So, I didn't >> have to worry about managing package updates with any frequency. > > I don't have any hard measurements, but my recollection is that installing > ~1200 packages on those systems and "loading the world" took something like > 5 minutes, while a similar set of packages installed in a unified directory > takes about 1.5 minutes. I just skimmed through the initial message, and when reading this my initial thought is does the the advantage justify effort/complexity, considering that most users have an order of magnitude fewer packages installed (of which a few are installed using package-vc which IIUC would explicitly not want to make use of this feature). -- Philip Kaludercic