From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Xiyue Deng Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [ELPA] New package c-intro-and-ref -- was Re: Proposal: Include C Manual from RMS in Emacs git, and/or release Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2024 23:15:36 -0800 Message-ID: <87y10qprvr.fsf@debian-hx90.lan> References: <87ser8c230.fsf@jeremybryant.net> <86ser87rut.fsf@gnu.org> <86cyia4503.fsf@gnu.org> <87bjxsbc8h.fsf@jeremybryant.net> <86a5db1vc6.fsf@gnu.org> <87v7vy2cho.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="38111"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Notmuch/0.38.3 (https://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/29.4 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: rms@gnu.org, Max Nikulin Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Dec 08 08:16:13 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1tKBWW-0009li-Kx for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 08 Dec 2024 08:16:12 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tKBWB-0001hV-PU; Sun, 08 Dec 2024 02:15:51 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tKBW5-0001dq-QZ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 08 Dec 2024 02:15:48 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-pg1-x529.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::529]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1tKBW3-0007Z7-HR; Sun, 08 Dec 2024 02:15:45 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-pg1-x529.google.com with SMTP id 41be03b00d2f7-7fd1dcbbc08so2244411a12.3; Sat, 07 Dec 2024 23:15:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1733642140; x=1734246940; darn=gnu.org; h=mime-version:message-id:date:user-agent:references:in-reply-to :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=XHehO0XokHAF5xCvN1EVUcnSbwvRkf99CZiKNTig4wA=; b=Js6Nv5fWyWRg/IIlo1j0ygClxkt2k73wsX7JLE07PUtGv2IDmkswOq5alQBfpDpTVE sZZHMBVgWE1ACu3L4G0jr71URPZrglNrqwt+6Km72eZtMdi2+vYlq8OvubdPvg5VtA4j Q8BLYH5dSzFAzJrAlvghz0GqJ8cNjYVqWjAWH0iaKtqCJS3psslA+YBpxojUKrofYkk9 Ipp2yERIzNM+0t2axiC/kVc8TEekFO202fWNjAP1LWYdybznPxVZSBL7gVMtApmBb3cu gw84YDTuGE5F0KSJz+OTMsqSi5faO6/1xrrxVQqJSvx28GMSAHbiEh8mPTW/WiyvC6Kj bxHQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1733642140; x=1734246940; h=mime-version:message-id:date:user-agent:references:in-reply-to :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=XHehO0XokHAF5xCvN1EVUcnSbwvRkf99CZiKNTig4wA=; b=elz2yzxxTqLiD9i0HaSvmnduBpFAOMde+mjyrBQj2B2s/MtbZE4si1r7w8YnevlK9t K+zVfyCRmx5DTeIKmH0XgsNgjDt650/PvFUdlCbtFt0zHyhEHSCJwG6h6FILPOyWc4Dz 9/Y0H58L1InUjaF0HpdoTH00NKJ+szongyCt0luGsu8aPe8ikUXTKgTbfUZhTU33KEzT Nm8AMov40ckjLJIzdb6ubxOfiR22SC72UZXe/Z+NRfSo9p9PwSUJeUPDaqYOkhnLt4YS YpUDiGluWxlSmwvs2CanSV962l6/nkqAQVN75MIXFbaj5YIOLtgrzixKuuoUqFe2sed/ cOWw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxU7CMLymUbBQcCaVjSCxnciMOC6pm1Gdyaf+wIMq6zHZdTrfSg sJrxYHKMcXlRvT7m0jLh3/pTotisEbpBOYDW0yuVDtETGvkqNYJTkuDzwjDD X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncvjp05SdFqFNwONmkGUv/SrdU0A/mhZIX3YeD5QfsmS5Ti7QmWYcsfdnYE4uX8 v/quGxDu1z7niBcRovWSm6SmeAKkmqdfFxA8Cp5oygrP+vj5tz17PyUTbOrfHqku20eRH6ptzL6 57krvz0vyQ55CivwPNnP0sLGN9jXWSuEmXFozawJlmPZRZCMWHXTCHPN5YRbNZFSyEiWQYdIX8N rmwSNkH+qPG/d3XD8yDLiGe+Q6tRaufCDDG7BsgZKgLAEu45eK9tO2/VA+E/GEQRtDIJgmTmiHQ ymahifJg X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGXS85h7iySmN2M/qLIlP0nUZoVFpmIbCi4SvgGpINBCBvq5rEw6b0k5zG35DhgEX92T5yILg== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:da88:b0:216:48b8:158c with SMTP id d9443c01a7336-21648b817b8mr5031165ad.28.1733642140256; Sat, 07 Dec 2024 23:15:40 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from debian-hx90 (syn-076-094-249-045.res.spectrum.com. [76.94.249.45]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id d9443c01a7336-215f8e66ba7sm52577155ad.100.2024.12.07.23.15.39 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 07 Dec 2024 23:15:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::529; envelope-from=manphiz@gmail.com; helo=mail-pg1-x529.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:326181 Archived-At: --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Richard Stallman writes: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > > > It would also make sense to make the Emacs manuals available for ea= sy > > > download, as distributions like Debian do not include these by defa= ult. > > How about if we make ALL the GNU manuals available in one place > as .deb packages, for the same of people with Debian-nased distros? > > What is the emacs-common-non-dfsg package? > (I'm not an official Debian Developer, but below are public knowledge in the Debian community so hopefully I'm not giving incorrect information) TL;DR: The Emacs documentation is under GFDL with an invariant section, which is not considered compliant to Debian Free Software Guideline (DFSG), so its documentation is split into a separate emacs-common-non-dfsg[1] package and is only available in the "non-free" section. Longer story: According to one of Debian's General Resolutions[2], the GNU Free Document License with an invariant section is considered too restrictive and hence does not meet Debian's standards for free software. Therefore, documents under such licenses needs to be under the "non-free" section, which is not enabled by default. As a result, many Emacs packages under GFDL with an invariant section that are packaged in Debian have their documentation either removed or put in a separate package in the "non-free" section. Examples including Emacs[3] (with emacs-common-non-dfsg split to the non-free section), compat[4], dash[5], org-mode[6] (with org-mode-doc[7] split to the non-free section), etc. Note that their version numbers have "+dfsg" in it, because the source packages included in Debian are modified by removing the non-free part - documents. As a quick overview for package sections: Debian packages are split into several main sections: main, contrib, non-free, and recently non-free-firmware. "main" (and recently "non-free-firmware") is enabled by default when installing Debian, and user can choose to enable "contrib" and "non-free" later. "non-free" section contains packages that are under a license that is not DFSG-compliant (see [8] for more detailed description), "contrib" is for packages that are DFSG-compliant but depend on packages in the "non-free" section. "non-free-firmware"[9] is for firmware packages which are "non-free" but required for running Debian in certain hardware, especially in recent hardware, and hence are available during installation. > --=20 > Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) > Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) > Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) > Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org) > > > [1] https://packages.debian.org/sid/emacs-common-non-dfsg [2] https://www.debian.org/vote/2006/vote_001 [3] https://packages.debian.org/sid/emacs [4] https://packages.debian.org/sid/elpa-compat [5] https://packages.debian.org/sid/elpa-dash [6] https://packages.debian.org/sid/elpa-org [7] https://packages.debian.org/sid/org-mode-doc [8] https://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#the-non-free-a= rchive-area [9] https://www.debian.org/vote/2022/vote_003 =2D-=20 Regards, Xiyue Deng --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQJGBAEBCgAwFiEEiKQfd6o81mjI+LWALell7WOCXJMFAmdVR5gSHG1hbnBoaXpA Z21haWwuY29tAAoJEC3pZe1jglyTs2cP/3UmUstaveB1dsyG5BBKEmxzYJ7unaJ3 RS29yjZ5N8h+mafY6jjU1bOu25uccKX01CM1KJlpN6SlfQNxzZ3sch2NyGGf8dvR 8hArebvslmdPvqaAW+qtP+5+hG54wxkDHUouof1hKVsafgtTuO/jroDbpZm14pqr oq3CUgK5MCzsg1RvtKoxRVUHXzeEvb32Y/KPbnavpnVjGDlE3hdZR+JQH087N+t5 5G6LffN6245G7EySiOq67kFKy2G8F8f9erpNj+YOc9DogxNZBjavH/RAnfK9UXDX tC8vDR2oXRzjYB7sXrAJKLJeCDF9YSH4a0+uhbuY+uQzS4iZkigbA3H5J5J9f6j7 hH/sZB2U9lppwcAlodRBS1gvf3ojgc/cNRsJuHFOhgbAS8Lihh42XY5ZM7odfHzd AADiwgoYHywrGlL02jGEmzOd1WWDWpVfXGqiMs8bxDNzPX7mEcngTqtTFCoTSR8A zykNR1KpmmUavWfvynKSpoQnQ5cYh0tfAadN4UDw5hW0SJ0iFg2wF461EyFHWugJ xZ2xhdMICx0Ur/IeDZT0s/4bOCAYh+mimgQNVubXLFre/MTNq0bgnZqeRHlts+G/ x2vUmiWG6g0vanQ+fANVFKibBI5g6c0fvZpyF+1Y0lH9SAyVvXLEP8P6G9RYB31N x2gxdU11kFLR =GR8R -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--