Re: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

Re: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Joost Kremers]

Drew Adams wrote:
> I have a new Dell Latitude D620 laptop. I have everything, including Emacs,
> installed identically to the way I had it on my old machine. However, the
> key sequences `C-M-right', `C-M-left', `C-M-up', and `C-M-down' are
> apparently not being sent to Emacs from the keyboard of the new machine.
[...]
> I've looked through the Emacs doc. I've tried to google for something about
> this, but I haven't found anything. Anyone know what's going on and how to
> fix it? Thanks.

sounds to me like you shouldn't be looking at emacs for the problem. is
perhaps you window manager hogging the key combo? check for keyboard
shortcuts in your wm's configuration, and see if C-M-<cursor> is used for
something.

-- 
Joost Kremers                                      joostkremers@yahoo.com
Selbst in die Unterwelt dringt durch Spalten Licht
EN:SiS(9)

RE: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Drew Adams]

> > I have a new Dell Latitude D620 laptop. I have everything,
> > including Emacs, installed identically to the way I had it
> > on my old machine. However, the key sequences `C-M-right',
> > `C-M-left', `C-M-up', and `C-M-down' are apparently not
> > being sent to Emacs from the keyboard of the new machine.
> > [...] I've looked through the Emacs doc. I've tried to
> > google for something about this, but I haven't found
> > anything. Anyone know what's going on and how to
> > fix it? Thanks.
>
> sounds to me like you shouldn't be looking at emacs for the problem. is
> perhaps you window manager hogging the key combo? check for keyboard
> shortcuts in your wm's configuration, and see if C-M-<cursor> is used for
> something.

I'm not "looking at emacs for the problem". I'm asking Emacs users if they
happen to know something about the problem and solution.

I should have added that I'm on Windows XP SP2 (same as on the old machine,
which has no such problem). I should also add that it is not the physical
laptop keyboard that is the problem - I get the same symptoms when I attach
an external keyboard to the laptop. (The keyboard listed in Control Panel >
Keyboard is "Standard 101/102-Key or Microsoft Natural PS/2 Keyboard - same
as on the old machine.)

I don't know how to determine whether Windows is somehow co-opting those key
sequences, and if it is, I don't know how to prevent that. Suggestions
welcome.

I might add that C-right, M-right, and C-M-S-right are each sent to Emacs
OK. It is only C-M-right (and -left etc.) that is apparently not passed to
Emacs.

And I can use C-M-S-right in place of C-M-right (as long as C-M-S-right has
no separate Emacs binding), because of the automatic Shift key translation.
IOW, C-h k C-M-S-right shows this: "<C-M-right> (translated from
<C-M-S-right>) runs the command forward-sexp". However, I want to be able to
bind C-M-S- separately from C-M- (IOW, use them both).

Naturally, no Dell doc came with the machine. And I looked in vain through
whatever Windows doc I could find (including about keyboard shortcuts). I've
read about Windows FilterKeys, MouseKeys, SerialKeys, StickyKeys, doskeys,
and other stuff. I've searched the MS knowlege base. Nothing helped.

Anyone have an idea? For starters, how can I see if C-M-right is in fact
assigned to something as a Windows shortcut? (It is not a standard Windows
shortcut, AFAICT, and nothing happens if I use it.) If it is not, what might
cause Emacs not to receive it?

All of the C-M-<arrow> keys have the same problem in Emacs, and none of them
do anything outside of Emacs, AFAICT. The keypad arrow keys act the same as
the normal arrow keys (except C-M-S-kp-right is not automatically translated
to C-M-kp-right, etc.).

Thx for any help.

Re: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Tim X]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

> I have a new Dell Latitude D620 laptop. I have everything, including Emacs,
> installed identically to the way I had it on my old machine. However, the
> key sequences `C-M-right', `C-M-left', `C-M-up', and `C-M-down' are
> apparently not being sent to Emacs from the keyboard of the new machine.
>
> In emacs -Q (it doesn't matter which Emacs version), `C-h k' followed by
> using `C-M-right' still waits for me to hit a key - the `C-M-right' is not
> seen by Emacs at all. Opening a dribble file shows the same thing:
> `C-M-right' key sequences are not recorded.
>
> I've looked through the Emacs doc. I've tried to google for something about
> this, but I haven't found anything. Anyone know what's going on and how to
> fix it? Thanks.
>

Are you running under X? If so, what window manager are you using?

I'm wondering if it is either a modmap issue or if your window manager
might be stealing the keys and not passing them on to emacs. If your
running under X, are you running from within an XTerm or 'native' X
Toolkit/GTK? as I've seen xterms have similar issues as well.

The fact the keystrokes are not showing up in a dribble file makes me think
they are not getting passed to emacs at all and therefore the problem isn't
actually emacs.

Tim


-- 
tcross (at) rapttech dot com dot au

RE: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Drew Adams]

> > I have a new Dell Latitude D620 laptop. I have everything,
> > including Emacs, installed identically to the way I had it
> > on my old machine. However, the key sequences `C-M-right',
> > `C-M-left', `C-M-up', and `C-M-down' are apparently not
> > being sent to Emacs from the keyboard of the new machine.
> >
> > In emacs -Q (it doesn't matter which Emacs version), `C-h k'
> > followed by using `C-M-right' still waits for me to hit a
> > key - the `C-M-right' is not seen by Emacs at all. Opening
> > a dribble file shows the same thing:
> > `C-M-right' key sequences are not recorded.
> >
> > I've looked through the Emacs doc. I've tried to google for
> > something about this, but I haven't found anything. Anyone
> > know what's going on and how to fix it? Thanks.
>
> Are you running under X? If so, what window manager are you using?

No, I'm on MS Windows - a native Emacs build. I do have Cygwin installed
also, but the Emacs I use is not a Cygwin Emacs.

> I'm wondering if it is either a modmap issue or if your window manager
> might be stealing the keys and not passing them on to emacs. If your
> running under X, are you running from within an XTerm or 'native' X
> Toolkit/GTK? as I've seen xterms have similar issues as well.
>
> The fact the keystrokes are not showing up in a dribble file
> makes me think they are not getting passed to emacs at all and
> therefore the problem isn't actually emacs.

I agree; the problem is not Emacs. I just don't know how to find the problem
(and solution). (The same Emacs builds (20, 22) work fine on the old laptop,
which is supposedly almost identical, so Emacs is not the culprit.) I'm
hoping someone here might have run into this or otherwise has an idea.

Re: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Sean Sieger]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

   No, I'm on MS Windows - a native Emacs build. I do have Cygwin installed
   also, but the Emacs I use is not a Cygwin Emacs.

Drew, I sure would like to see your build instructions, if you have them
documented.

RE: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Drew Adams]

>    No, I'm on MS Windows - a native Emacs build. I do have Cygwin
>    installed also, but the Emacs I use is not a Cygwin Emacs.
>
> Drew, I sure would like to see your build instructions, if you have them
> documented.

I didn't build Emacs myself. I just use the binary provided by GNU (22.1).
Separately, I installed Cygwin.

Re: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Tim X]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

>> > I have a new Dell Latitude D620 laptop. I have everything,
>> > including Emacs, installed identically to the way I had it
>> > on my old machine. However, the key sequences `C-M-right',
>> > `C-M-left', `C-M-up', and `C-M-down' are apparently not
>> > being sent to Emacs from the keyboard of the new machine.
>> >
>> > In emacs -Q (it doesn't matter which Emacs version), `C-h k'
>> > followed by using `C-M-right' still waits for me to hit a
>> > key - the `C-M-right' is not seen by Emacs at all. Opening
>> > a dribble file shows the same thing:
>> > `C-M-right' key sequences are not recorded.
>> >
>> > I've looked through the Emacs doc. I've tried to google for
>> > something about this, but I haven't found anything. Anyone
>> > know what's going on and how to fix it? Thanks.
>>
>> Are you running under X? If so, what window manager are you using?
>
> No, I'm on MS Windows - a native Emacs build. I do have Cygwin installed
> also, but the Emacs I use is not a Cygwin Emacs.
>
>> I'm wondering if it is either a modmap issue or if your window manager
>> might be stealing the keys and not passing them on to emacs. If your
>> running under X, are you running from within an XTerm or 'native' X
>> Toolkit/GTK? as I've seen xterms have similar issues as well.
>>
>> The fact the keystrokes are not showing up in a dribble file
>> makes me think they are not getting passed to emacs at all and
>> therefore the problem isn't actually emacs.
>
> I agree; the problem is not Emacs. I just don't know how to find the problem
> (and solution). (The same Emacs builds (20, 22) work fine on the old laptop,
> which is supposedly almost identical, so Emacs is not the culprit.) I'm
> hoping someone here might have run into this or otherwise has an idea.
>

The only thing I can suggest is possibly doing a registry compare. Not
bbing much of a windows user, I can't be more specific. However, I do seem
to remember seeing something about registry tweaks and emacs. Is it
possible you made a registry change on the old laptop and have forgotten
about it? 

also, just wondering if the following (taken from the Emacs Problems file)
might be relevant?

** On MS-Windows, you cannot use the right-hand ALT key and the left-hand
CTRL key together to type a Control-Meta character.

This is a consequence of a misfeature beyond Emacs's control.

Under Windows, the AltGr key on international keyboards generates key
events with the modifiers Right-Alt and Left-Ctrl.  Since Emacs cannot
distinguish AltGr from an explicit Right-Alt and Left-Ctrl
combination, whenever it sees Right-Alt and Left-Ctrl it assumes that
AltGr has been pressed.  The variable `w32-recognize-altgr' can be set
to nil to tell Emacs that AltGr is really Ctrl and Alt.

Tim

>

-- 
tcross (at) rapttech dot com dot au

RE: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Drew Adams]

> >> > I have a new Dell Latitude D620 laptop. I have everything,
> >> > including Emacs, installed identically to the way I had it
> >> > on my old machine. However, the key sequences `C-M-right',
> >> > `C-M-left', `C-M-up', and `C-M-down' are apparently not
> >> > being sent to Emacs from the keyboard of the new machine.
> >> >
> >> > In emacs -Q (it doesn't matter which Emacs version), `C-h k'
> >> > followed by using `C-M-right' still waits for me to hit a
> >> > key - the `C-M-right' is not seen by Emacs at all. Opening
> >> > a dribble file shows the same thing:
> >> > `C-M-right' key sequences are not recorded.
> >> >
> >> > I've looked through the Emacs doc. I've tried to google for
> >> > something about this, but I haven't found anything. Anyone
> >> > know what's going on and how to fix it? Thanks.
>
> The only thing I can suggest is possibly doing a registry compare. Not
> bbing much of a windows user, I can't be more specific. However, I do seem
> to remember seeing something about registry tweaks and emacs. Is it
> possible you made a registry change on the old laptop and have forgotten
> about it?

No, I don't think so. I rarely touch the registry. I don't know a tool to
compare the two registries, in any case. And, as I said, the symptoms are
the same with all Emacs versions.

> also, just wondering if the following (taken from the Emacs Problems file)
> might be relevant?
>
> ** On MS-Windows, you cannot use the right-hand ALT key and the left-hand
> CTRL key together to type a Control-Meta character.
>
> Under Windows, the AltGr key on international keyboards generates key
> events with the modifiers Right-Alt and Left-Ctrl.  Since Emacs cannot
> distinguish AltGr from an explicit Right-Alt and Left-Ctrl
> combination, whenever it sees Right-Alt and Left-Ctrl it assumes that
> AltGr has been pressed.  The variable `w32-recognize-altgr' can be set
> to nil to tell Emacs that AltGr is really Ctrl and Alt.

No, I already tried changing `w32-recognize-altgr'. Also, I don't have an
AltGr key, and I also tried every Ctrl and Alt combination (left-left,
left-right, right-left, right-right).

Are there no Windows Emacs users with an idea about this?

Re: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Sean Sieger]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

   Are there no Windows Emacs users with an idea about this?

There's a fairly recent BIOS update for your Latitude:

http://support.dell.com/support/downloads/driverslist.aspx?os=WW1&osl=EN&catid=1&impid=-1&servicetag=&SystemID=LATITUDE+D620&hidos=WW1&hidlang=en

Re: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: "Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com>
> Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2007 06:54:50 -0700
> 
> Are there no Windows Emacs users with an idea about this?

Drew, what do you want us to tell you? we are not magicians.  It's
obviously some configuration issue with that specific machine.

You should look at each and every program that installs itself at
startup (I recommend the wonderful StartupList program for this), and
see whether it could grab these keystrokes.

Also, look at various Windows features that are modify keyboard ops,
like "Accessibility Options" in "Control Panel" and "Advanced Key
Settings" under "Regional and Language Options" in "Control Panel".

Somewhere among these you will find your villain.

Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Drew Adams]

I have a new Dell Latitude D620 laptop. I have everything, including Emacs,
installed identically to the way I had it on my old machine. However, the
key sequences `C-M-right', `C-M-left', `C-M-up', and `C-M-down' are
apparently not being sent to Emacs from the keyboard of the new machine.

In emacs -Q (it doesn't matter which Emacs version), `C-h k' followed by
using `C-M-right' still waits for me to hit a key - the `C-M-right' is not
seen by Emacs at all. Opening a dribble file shows the same thing:
`C-M-right' key sequences are not recorded.

I've looked through the Emacs doc. I've tried to google for something about
this, but I haven't found anything. Anyone know what's going on and how to
fix it? Thanks.

RE: Emacs not receiving C-M-right from keyboard

[Drew Adams]

> I have a new Dell Latitude D620 laptop. I have everything,
> including Emacs, installed identically to the way I had it on
> my old machine. However, the key sequences `C-M-right',
> `C-M-left', `C-M-up', and `C-M-down' are
> apparently not being sent to Emacs from the keyboard of the
> new machine.
>
> In emacs -Q (it doesn't matter which Emacs version), `C-h k'
> followed by using `C-M-right' still waits for me to hit a
> key - the `C-M-right' is not seen by Emacs at all. Opening a
> dribble file shows the same thing:
> `C-M-right' key sequences are not recorded.
>
> I've looked through the Emacs doc. I've tried to google for
> something about this, but I haven't found anything. Anyone
> know what's going on and how to fix it? Thanks.

My thanks to Peter Povinec for the solution, which he found here:
http://www.edugeek.net/index.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=68720.

These are hotkeys that come from a recent Intel graphic chip. The
C-M-<arrow> keys actually rotate the display!

Here's how to turn off all such graphic hot keys, for others who might be
interested:

Right-click the desktop > Settings tab > Advanced > Click the bar across the
top, behind the tabs (the bar is labeled "Intel(R) Graphics Media
Accelerator Driver for Mobile") > Graphics Properties... > Hot Keys >
uncheck Enable Hot Keys > OK > OK > OK.

Whew! Thanks, Peter. Crazy, huh? - Drew