From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Xiao-Yong Jin Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: a look at the browser scene & emacs Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 08:13:34 -0500 Message-ID: <87wsbezmkh.fsf@columbia.edu> References: <8358de80-5198-41e5-b4a2-04e681d359d1@p20g2000yqi.googlegroups.com> <86wsbeajz6.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1235567730 8354 80.91.229.12 (25 Feb 2009 13:15:30 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 13:15:30 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Feb 25 14:16:46 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1LcJcr-0005ah-Ke for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2009 14:16:38 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46128 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LcJbW-0002vv-P5 for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2009 08:15:14 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LcJaE-0002fL-7y for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2009 08:13:54 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1LcJaC-0002ep-DP for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2009 08:13:53 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=51839 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1LcJaC-0002ej-8G for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2009 08:13:52 -0500 Original-Received: from serrano.cc.columbia.edu ([128.59.29.6]:49877) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1LcJaC-0004Vb-2A for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Feb 2009 08:13:52 -0500 Original-Received: from lattice (latticeqcd.phys.columbia.edu [128.59.169.70]) (user=xj2106 mech=PLAIN bits=0) by serrano.cc.columbia.edu (8.14.3/8.14.1) with ESMTP id n1PDDoex015762 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2009 08:13:51 -0500 (EST) Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAAD1BMVEXcBwj0AgP8AADrysTUU1gp luy9AAACUklEQVQ4jW1U0bHjIAwUhgIs2QUYzgXgEQWYiP5ruhVO8u7NnD4yxMsirVZA2st/4jCq 2RdZfn2Xkig8y8y/oJyJh0dIqm0phQv+B2wrlE0R1X8DSCsWDadkyishmjJLzrzj6zoRYt9bWxM/ OM1vYHWh3CbDhux84DsjgDCAhOQtat+W4046ow4HIlad9yuGLHHWOHpGDhzFTPd52VKy0QzOMssN ueleDfn1fRQYZaX4WptZUwc+R0H5zbEDwD4I1sC0ojKBcpXYrG6pNjn0E21BjgVlXdu4msy+WfNf IbE73mkCaFDgsr2QFk0sLkOvOC6Fcq0AvNCFJH4YKkyksr32Nm75MtIFHbnEZXv96SgcOZDOqgMw agLIUtyoAB3V0hWXIhzDBESmDheINMs/OgAM3nseY+17OOwLMBVGK+GvGyTPrHDObm106x96STAm SxJMC3RgFHMaOqwjh/uJFt8ZOi7Uj/4t8dob6dtcCNzQtJtJg73OKkZo4xgE4PQNc99y1mL2ZZz6 7vUtp3ZLdqNjhO4eGoo7hxE/Mapg3FMgSpUJQMZem5GNgLregDuACk4AP4zDp2OfyZ0BHTStnYAw Zj72/WHom9HmXZK8XQD0Ue6Ms1Egb95k6DqBUN4CKzjmOTQ+RwHYPoAnV33GGsplqy4BJWvYa1Tj 7GkEfrz8MrsnYBxq4uZUWOvAvNqeI2tc1uYDCUb3ozBShqpYY8B1vQVG7Z/ksZ+KEUPngBQK8wVw wIdF+0CbOUF5z3M+/JaLL9ifmIwWtZ/HxWGR5zGyv9F0pEDk9NRcAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC Mail-Followup-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org In-Reply-To: <86wsbeajz6.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz> (David Kastrup's message of "Wed, 25 Feb 2009 11:28:45 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.90 (gnu/linux) X-No-Spam-Score: Local X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.65 on 128.59.29.6 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: Solaris 9 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:62365 Archived-At: David Kastrup writes: > Xah Lee writes: > >> News about the browser world >> http://www.macworld.com/article/139022/2009/02/safari4firstlook.html?t= =3D232 >> >> emacs really needs to keep up. >> >> The IDE idea, from 1990s to 2000, basically reduced emacs market share >> from perhaps more than 50% in the early 1990s to maybe 1% today among >> professional programers. >> >> emacs today has lots of problems. Many of the =E2=80=9Cemacs way=E2=80= =9D, are >> technically inferior. But the nice elisp system holds it back still. >> >> The way for emacs to advance, is to get more people to use emacs. >> Emacs users today are already just the very small clique, half of >> which are perhaps over 40. With these small circle of people, every >> idea that's not =E2=80=9Cemacs way=E2=80=9D gets stamped out. > > Or gets adapted to the Emacs way. The result is that people get one > consistent tool. As a under 40 user, I very much like the idea of being consistent. I don't like CUA mode and the new default transient mark mode behavior. But I do like the idea of improving the display back-end of Emacs. I love the upcoming version 23 because of the anti-aliased font support and much better handling of multibyte character encoding system. Nowadays, there are usually only three kinds of program on my desktop. a. Emacs b. urxvt c. firefox All sorts of shell modes in Emacs are slow compared to urxvt. And all web browsing modes are just lame. I do most of my work in Emacs, but external term and browser is indispensable, as for now. I would very much like to see the ideal society where people only fire up Emacs and do all sort of things in the good old Emacs way. An efficient, functional and versatile display back-end is what Emacs is really lack of. This might be what Emacs can learn from webkit or XUL. Xiao-Yong --=20 c/* __o/* <\ * (__ */\ <