From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "William G. Gardella" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Frequently Enabled Packages - Emacs-24.4 survey (Please participate) Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2013 06:23:00 +0000 Message-ID: <87wqjeilvf.fsf@motoko.kusanagi> References: <87ppp7nqqa.fsf@gmail.com> <87k3ffm18p.fsf@motoko.kusanagi> <87d2l6zkdp.fsf@gmail.com> <877gbek34z.fsf@motoko.kusanagi> <87ob4qy34k.fsf@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1386570220 28912 80.91.229.3 (9 Dec 2013 06:23:40 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2013 06:23:40 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Dec 09 07:23:44 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VpuFq-00013v-Lv for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 09 Dec 2013 07:23:42 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42127 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VpuFq-0006sG-9M for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 09 Dec 2013 01:23:42 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:42145) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VpuFX-0006rz-Ua for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 09 Dec 2013 01:23:31 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VpuFQ-0001sY-KA for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 09 Dec 2013 01:23:23 -0500 Original-Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:43772) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VpuFQ-0001sT-DP for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 09 Dec 2013 01:23:16 -0500 Original-Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VpuFP-0000qJ-0J for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 09 Dec 2013 07:23:15 +0100 Original-Received: from 37.221.161.234 ([37.221.161.234]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Mon, 09 Dec 2013 07:23:15 +0100 Original-Received: from wgg2 by 37.221.161.234 with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Mon, 09 Dec 2013 07:23:15 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 23 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: 37.221.161.234 User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:jt+HrcEflvqaI7s1tt2JLw+M1x0= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 80.91.229.3 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:94893 Archived-At: Jambunathan K writes: > You think you are prosecuting me. You also sit in the judge's chair. I > am NOT on the defence benches. > > If you could set aside the Hon. Judge's robes and alight the chair you > you are sitting in, we can have some meaningful discussion. Ok. I'll put it more simply. This survey as presently organized is stupid drudgery, and the purpose of Emacs (like any good hack) is to eliminate such. Resorting to drudgery when automation is available is doubly stupid. As I said, if the project wants accurate data about what minor modes are used, I think the way to do this is with M-x report-emacs-bug, which has "Minor modes in effect:" as a subset of its data--as opposed to the drudgery of making users manually enter data on the [unofficial] wiki. The bad policy-making that could result from an inaccurate survey is that some modes will be overcounted and some will be undercounted. That won't lead to "apocalypse," just to an editor/environment that's worse than it potentially could be, with less sane defaults. Bad data is better than no data, admittedly, but this data is really bad.