From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ivan Shmakov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: HTML-Info design Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2014 12:20:26 +0000 Message-ID: <87wq5aabqt.fsf@violet.siamics.net> References: <83bnmvowdb.fsf@gnu.org> <83ppbanqhe.fsf@gnu.org> <87vbl2xigp.fsf@ferrier.me.uk> <83ioh2nlow.fsf@gnu.org> <87sig6xech.fsf@ferrier.me.uk> <83fvc5ni0u.fsf@gnu.org> <87k31fwwyv.fsf@ferrier.me.uk> <87bnmq9ibf.fsf@ferrier.me.uk> <87lhlrx5fc.fsf@building.gnus.org> <878uhrcr5l.fsf@building.gnus.org> <83sifzjflk.fsf@gnu.org> <87fvbyagaw.fsf@building.gnus.org> <871tnibsu7.fsf@violet.siamics.net> <87y4pq8zcy.fsf@building.gnus.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1419855664 27107 80.91.229.3 (29 Dec 2014 12:21:04 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2014 12:21:04 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Dec 29 13:21:00 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Y5ZJc-00050D-1z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 29 Dec 2014 13:20:52 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:33089 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y5ZJb-0007BG-C8 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 29 Dec 2014 07:20:51 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:36253) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y5ZJT-00078r-RA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 29 Dec 2014 07:20:48 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y5ZJP-0005Co-SJ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 29 Dec 2014 07:20:43 -0500 Original-Received: from fely.am-1.org ([2a01:4f8:d15:1b86::2]:52973) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y5ZJP-0005Ca-HS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 29 Dec 2014 07:20:39 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=siamics.net; s=a2013295; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date:Sender:References:Subject:To:From; bh=irTer0/9cQt0APCSVKx+6Vx4hucitYD/VJ9+YJS5xmk=; b=fzOrWiOP940PTD3h+c9aWoglYDvj0KmLZ++LKqMSJiaMWo/MJ96oI5sdUsc4ez3Up+R4zBbwmuuAUKCN7Xipf8iCW74+Ysn5i+NemNZNyLHgqqMYSH6sQH/eNdLAj2ztoYFnd5SEJE4fujdfHuxn6nITmertt3M5NTJUF7LKZoM=; Original-Received: from [2a02:2560:6d4:26ca::1:1d] (helo=violet.siamics.net) by fely.am-1.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Y5ZJK-0000qT-MK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 29 Dec 2014 12:20:35 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=violet.siamics.net) by violet.siamics.net with esmtps (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1Y5ZJD-0001oB-Ce for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 29 Dec 2014 19:20:27 +0700 Mail-Followup-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org In-Reply-To: <87y4pq8zcy.fsf@building.gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Mon, 29 Dec 2014 12:33:17 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a01:4f8:d15:1b86::2 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:180811 Archived-At: >>>>> Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: >>>>> Ivan Shmakov writes: >> As per the current shr.el version, this only affects HTML documents >> which use tables to implement such layouts, =E2=80=93 and HTML5 already >> discourages that [1]: > The reality is that these layouts are very common. I don't see any > need to discuss that point further. Good. Still, such layouts are a nuisance to deal with in EWW (or with any other code that relies on SHR, for that matter.) Consider, for instance, the following: This is the sidebar, which This is the page content proper. is placed to the left of the Emacs may apply its usual =E2=80=9Cpayload=E2=80=9D content in the facilities to flow = it as browsers implementing (a necessary, without any trouble larger subset of) CSS. whatsoever. For one thing, many Unless being tweaked by the MediaWiki instances use exactly user to his or her own this layout. taste, that is. Now, what=E2=80=99s the easy way to put the second sentence of the right column into the kill ring? My idea is that EWW should provide a way for the user to ignore the =E2=80=9Clayout=E2=80=9D tables, =E2=80=93 either applying some heuris= tics (there=E2=80=99re some ideas on that in [1], BTW), or via an explicit user command (not dissimilar to eww-readable, I guess, =E2=80=93 I do not seem to understand what the latter is intended to do.) Or both. Sure, we may instead try to improve the Emacs display model to support such layouts natively, but, well, =E2=80=93 I won=E2=80=99t believe /that/ until I see actual patches to that end. >> [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/tabular-data.html#the-table-element --=20 FSF associate member #7257 http://boycottsystemd.org/ =E2=80=A6 3013 B6A0= 230E 334A