From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Oleh Krehel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Upcoming loss of usability of Emacs source files and Emacs. Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2015 15:24:35 +0200 Message-ID: <87wpyvnaek.fsf@gmail.com> References: <20150615142237.GA3517@acm.fritz.box> <87mw01uj06.fsf@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1434979954 16422 80.91.229.3 (22 Jun 2015 13:32:34 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2015 13:32:34 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Alan Mackenzie Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Jun 22 15:32:28 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Z71pr-0007Zc-TW for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 15:32:28 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40179 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z71pr-0004uO-9y for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 09:32:27 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:59041) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z71oj-0003p2-84 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 09:31:18 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z71of-00027Y-7t for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 09:31:17 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wg0-x236.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c00::236]:35147) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Z71of-00027U-1D for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 09:31:13 -0400 Original-Received: by wgbhy7 with SMTP id hy7so141557272wgb.2 for ; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 06:31:12 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=m7HJBEz5VLw2dISv6yGsnfVHOMKdWltS43wDSJVGKtY=; b=BS0zK+F+wPYFrSMRJ4yYsV7Hi2t0zF9340+FVHiR0SbjC7v7lsZG2RpXG7geX9CK2D F4Ovi8En2I2iGInK8S9nDMiQRIc8FlOO3iM79bXJ1hfDFvXm7TcA00ZZ9JM0g6aH0cmT eO7TdkEh/JEA02zyVwyC+owgi/WAh924gG3jnJmXqGOWkI1cE1GCTk9mw178WTUE11Qh Savjc2eskbGr6Z8UNu6KBpfSCMLRw2AMaPYwTf2onI6je5iGX0VQHvExxCaOUG6c301m 2NhjOUP8y+bFqwi6BLhJxtgqFK6M6MprqJelKaBIsBQzB5QU1JEifd/m/2O0OXpZeTqj q3iA== X-Received: by 10.194.5.4 with SMTP id o4mr42261064wjo.51.1434979872429; Mon, 22 Jun 2015 06:31:12 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from firefly (dyn069045.nbw.tue.nl. [131.155.69.45]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id ha4sm16899000wib.0.2015.06.22.06.31.11 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 22 Jun 2015 06:31:11 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87mw01uj06.fsf@gmail.com> (Oleh Krehel's message of "Mon, 15 Jun 2015 16:46:33 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c00::236 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:187375 Archived-At: Oleh Krehel writes: > Alan Mackenzie writes: > >> My view is that the curly quotes should not replace 0x60 and 0x27 in our >> sources, but that the option to display them as curly quotes should be >> made available to those that want it. > > I completely agree. I often search sources using "`" and "'" in a > regex. Now it's hard to type that in. > > Additionally, I actually like to see "`" and "'" displayed. So if there > was an option to turn off "=E2=80=98" visually, I would do it in my confi= g. As I saw the (subjectively) ugly new quotation chars already being used in Emacs commit messages, I finally took the time to learn how display tables work. So for all people who actually like how the old-style quotation looks, this is how to replace visually all new-style quotation with old-style: (let ((tbl (make-display-table))) (aset tbl 8220 (vector (make-glyph-code ?\" 'default))) (aset tbl 8221 (vector (make-glyph-code ?\" 'default))) (aset tbl 8216 (vector (make-glyph-code ?\` 'default))) (aset tbl 8217 (vector (make-glyph-code ?\' 'default))) (setq standard-display-table tbl)) While we're on the subject of modifying the source code purely for aesthetics, I wanted to bring up the subject of Elisp indentation rules. But then I saw http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D20323, from which it appears that the problem is solved for two months already (although without a NEWS entry). Thanks to Dmitry for the change. There are still issues of `lisp-indent-function' being inferior to `common-lisp-indent-function' in some cases, but I can report them later.