Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Deric Bytes]

Can M-x list-packages be set up to show github emacs packages? 

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Sun, 5 Nov 2017 08:44:06 -0800 (PST) Deric Bytes <dericbytes@gmail.com> wrote: 

DB> Can M-x list-packages be set up to show github emacs packages? 

How would you define the list of "github emacs packages"?

How would you connect the notion of Git branches/tags and Github releases to
package releases?

What are you trying to accomplish, ultimately?

Thanks
Ted

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Deric Bytes]

I would like list-packages to work with packages from git repositories

1. User has to set some new list-packages preferences.

   ;; places to look for sources, ordered by preference
   (setq preference-of-source '(git melpa other1 other2))

   ;; if more than one source, only show one with highest preference
   (setq only-show-one-source t)

   ;; change prefered source for these exceptions - '(package source opts)
   (setq exceptions '((package-x melpa)
                      (package-y nil '((branch . "bleeding edge"))

   (setq default-branch 'master)

2. A list of known useful git sources is maintained within emacs.

   (setq available-git-packages '((package1 . get-recipe1)
                                  (package2 . get-recipe2))

   
3. Then M-x list-packages works like it normally does.
   when install is run it calls something like el-get with associated recipe.

4. a key binding is available to click on package and change recipe.
   i.e. set branch or tag.

RE: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Drew Adams]

> I would like list-packages to work with packages from git repositories

`M-x report-emacs-bug' is good for enhancement requests also.

List help-gnu-emacs is more for help questions.  There's
nothing wrong with posting suggestions/requests here, but
that's exactly the purpose of `M-x report-emacs-bug'.

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Deric Bytes]

Thanks Drew, I will bear that in mind

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Kendall Shaw]

On 11/06/2017 03:27 PM, Deric Bytes wrote:

> Thanks Drew, I will bear that in mind

Not exactly what you are asking about, but paradox includes the github 
repo for packages that have a repo in github.

https://github.com/Malabarba/paradox

kendall

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Mon, 6 Nov 2017 13:42:43 -0800 (PST) Deric Bytes <dericbytes@gmail.com> wrote: 

DB> I would like list-packages to work with packages from git repositories
...
DB> 2. A list of known useful git sources is maintained within emacs.
DB>    (setq available-git-packages '((package1 . get-recipe1)
DB>                                   (package2 . get-recipe2))
DB> 3. Then M-x list-packages works like it normally does.
DB>    when install is run it calls something like el-get with associated recipe.

Oh. So you want el-get but those get-recipes to be maintained for you. I
would talk to the el-get maintainers.

Ted

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Stefan Monnier]

> Oh. So you want el-get but those get-recipes to be maintained for you. I
> would talk to the el-get maintainers.

I think another part of the request makes sense: integrate this with
package.el.  I.e. package.el could provide some way to hook in non-ELPA
sources of packages (including browsing them via list-packages and
installing/ activating them).


        Stefan

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 08:43:36 -0500 Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote: 

>> Oh. So you want el-get but those get-recipes to be maintained for you. I
>> would talk to the el-get maintainers.

SM> I think another part of the request makes sense: integrate this with
SM> package.el.  I.e. package.el could provide some way to hook in non-ELPA
SM> sources of packages (including browsing them via list-packages and
SM> installing/ activating them).

I agree, but it would have to be clearly separated, so users are not
thinking those are ELPA-style packages. Maybe a separate section?

On Wed, 8 Nov 2017 11:14:29 -0800 (PST) Deric Bytes <dericbytes@gmail.com> wrote: 

DB>   I just meant there was a list of known packages from trusted git sources to browse. El-get already supplies a list like this. So the backend could just use that list.

I'd talk to the el-get maintainers. They can suggest how `list-packages'
could be extended or maybe a new command `list-recipes'.

DB>   I would like the ability to look at the recipe and change it. If a change is
DB> made then the default recipe would be copied to a user specified recipe and then
DB> overshadow the default one, so that on doing an update my config is still in
DB> tact.

This makes sense, but can get unpleasantly complicated. I'm not sure
most users want it.

Ted

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Stefan Monnier]

>>> Oh. So you want el-get but those get-recipes to be maintained for you. I
>>> would talk to the el-get maintainers.
SM> I think another part of the request makes sense: integrate this with
SM> package.el.  I.e. package.el could provide some way to hook in non-ELPA
SM> sources of packages (including browsing them via list-packages and
SM> installing/ activating them).
> I agree, but it would have to be clearly separated, so users are not
> thinking those are ELPA-style packages. Maybe a separate section?

I'd expect the hook to take place by adding non-ELPA "archives", so the
current display of the archive's name should be sufficient.

Why should the user care so much about which protocol is used to talk to
the archive?


        Stefan

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Fri, 10 Nov 2017 08:46:39 -0500 Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote: 

SM> Why should the user care so much about which protocol is used to talk to
SM> the archive?

Recipes and packages are not the same thing fundamentally.

SM> For the foreseeable future, only GNU ELPA will be in the default
SM> archives, so there's no need for a switch, since users would first have
SM> to "manually" add some other archive anyway (and probably install some
SM> third party package to add support for non-ELPA archives on top of
SM> that).

OK, but you're merging:

GNU and non-GNU ELPA package archives
el-get recipe archives
user's own el-get recipes (overriding or new)

Those are not the same thing. For instance, upgrading: do you upgrade
the *recipe definition*, or the *thing it defines* (e.g. a Git branch)?

Ted

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Deric Bytes]

Hi Ted,

  I just meant there was a list of known packages from trusted git sources to browse. El-get already supplies a list like this. So the backend could just use that list.

  I would like the ability to look at the recipe and change it. If a change is made then the default recipe would be copied to a user specified recipe and then overshadow the default one, so that on doing an update my config is still in tact.

  

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Deric Bytes]

* copied to a user specified directory

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Deric Bytes]

> I agree, but it would have to be clearly separated, so users are not
> thinking those are ELPA-style packages. 

I'd prefer there not be such a big distinction between the different types of packages. Various solutions
  
    - a toggle - big distinction/subtle distinction
    - differnet faces
    - or an extra tag with git/elpa/melpa/wiki
    - the non-Elpa packages are not on by default and have to be
      enabled by adding some setting i.e.
           `list-package-sources-in-preference-order'

> This makes sense, but can get unpleasantly complicated. I'm not sure
> most users want it. 

Currently el-get has find-recipe. Which opens the file containing the recipe which is a list of key value pairs. So maybe a key binding can be added that just does a find-file. If the user tries to save the file, it will be copied and saved in the users-personal-el-get-recipes-dir.

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Stefan Monnier]

> I'd prefer there not be such a big distinction between the different types of packages. Various solutions
  
>     - a toggle - big distinction/subtle distinction
>     - differnet faces
>     - or an extra tag with git/elpa/melpa/wiki
>     - the non-Elpa packages are not on by default and have to be
>       enabled by adding some setting i.e.
>            `list-package-sources-in-preference-order'

For the foreseeable future, only GNU ELPA will be in the default
archives, so there's no need for a switch, since users would first have
to "manually" add some other archive anyway (and probably install some
third party package to add support for non-ELPA archives on top of
that).


        Stefan

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Deric Bytes]

> Those are not the same thing. For instance, upgrading: do you upgrade
> the *recipe definition*, or the *thing it defines* (e.g. a Git branch)? 

The way I use el-get at the minute is: If i do an install/reinstall it grabs the latest git repo. 

Default recipies are updated when el-get is updated. My personal recipes are done manually.

Branch swapping needs a manual edit of the recipe. 

RE: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Drew Adams]

Doesn't `el-get' also have as a feature the ability to pull from
various different kinds of sources, including, say, Emacs Wiki?

IIUC, it is not limited to pulling from a GIT archive.  That's
a significant advantage, I would think.

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Mykola Nikishov]

Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

> Doesn't `el-get' also have as a feature the ability to pull from
> various different kinds of sources, including, say, Emacs Wiki?

Yes, it does [1]. For instance, apt-get support allows me to replace
package with version from Debian [2] with:

    (el-get-bundle org-mode :type apt-get :pkgname "elpa-org")

[1] https://github.com/dimitri/el-get/tree/master/methods/
[2] https://github.com/manandbytes/.emacs.d/blob/master/.emacs.d/emacs.org#install-platform-dependent-packages

-- 
Mykola
https://manandbytes.github.io/

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Ted Zlatanov]

On Fri, 10 Nov 2017 08:34:08 -0800 (PST) Deric Bytes <dericbytes@gmail.com> wrote: 

>> Those are not the same thing. For instance, upgrading: do you upgrade
>> the *recipe definition*, or the *thing it defines* (e.g. a Git branch)? 

DB> The way I use el-get at the minute is: If i do an install/reinstall it grabs the latest git repo. 

DB> Default recipies are updated when el-get is updated. My personal recipes are done manually.

DB> Branch swapping needs a manual edit of the recipe. 

You've ignored the main point and addressed the "for instance" I brought up.

Ted

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Emanuel Berg]

Ted Zlatanov wrote:

>> The way I use el-get at the minute is: If
>> i do an install/reinstall it grabs the
>> latest git repo.
>>
>> Default recipies are updated when el-get is
>> updated. My personal recipes are
>> done manually.
>>
>> Branch swapping needs a manual edit of
>> the recipe.
>
> You've ignored the main point and addressed
> the "for instance" I brought up.

He is telling/thinking how he has done it so
far, which is a way of meditating what could be
done next...

-- 
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573

Re: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Deric Bytes]

Yes it does. Here is an example of such a recipie that comes bundled with el-get

(:name dired-details+
       :description "Extensions to `dired-details.el'."
       :type emacswiki
       :depends (dired-details)
       :features "dired-details+")

RE: Can list-packages be set up to show latest github emacs packages?

[Drew Adams]

>> Doesn't `el-get' also have as a feature the ability to pull from
>> various different kinds of sources, including, say, Emacs Wiki?
>>
>> IIUC, it is not limited to pulling from a GIT archive.  That's
>> a significant advantage, I would think.
> 
> Yes it does. Here is an example of such a recipie that comes
> bundled with el-get...

Good to know, especially since MELPA has apparently decided
to no longer support Emacs Wiki.  GIT is fine, but it should
not be regarded as the only way - the be-all and end-all -
for users to distribute and retrieve Emacs libraries/packages.

If `el-get' supports multiple kinds of sources, including
but not limited to GIT archives, so much the better.  It's
too bad (IMHO) that MELPA has abandoned such an approach,
but that's OK.