From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eduardo Mercovich Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Interactive guide for new users Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2020 09:54:17 -0300 Message-ID: <87wo0kirgm.fsf@mercovich.net> References: <875z8ortot.fsf@gkayaalp.com> <83lfhjkq0r.fsf@gnu.org> <8620B5CD-CA92-46BF-80A8-DBE7052F4CA6@gmail.com> <87d02haj4g.fsf@mercovich.net> <87ft7dn0um.fsf@posteo.net> <831rix3ci8.fsf@gnu.org> <878sd5aba5.fsf@mercovich.net> <83y2l51uh1.fsf@gnu.org> <874knta1e4.fsf@mercovich.net> <83imc90zbk.fsf@gnu.org> <87eemun5dh.fsf@mercovich.net> <834knpykwl.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="10819"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: mu4e 1.3.3; emacs 27.1 Cc: self@gkayaalp.com, philipk@posteo.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org, casouri@gmail.com, stefankangas@gmail.com To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 23 14:57:49 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kL4LF-0002gG-4v for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 14:57:49 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:36966 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kL4LE-0004J2-4U for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 08:57:48 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:53700) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kL4IA-0001ib-E6 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 08:54:38 -0400 Original-Received: from gil.mayfirst.org ([162.247.75.206]:39845) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kL4I8-0008Ns-C8; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 08:54:38 -0400 Original-Received: from gil.mayfirst.org (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by gil.mayfirst.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 688FC5EAC; Wed, 23 Sep 2020 08:54:34 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (Authenticated sender: xxxxx) with ESMTPSA id AD1495E88 In-reply-to: <834knpykwl.fsf@gnu.org> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP Received-SPF: none client-ip=162.247.75.206; envelope-from=eduardo@mercovich.net; helo=gil.mayfirst.org X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/09/23 08:54:34 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:256356 Archived-At: Hello Eli. [...] >> 1- Let's collect a list of all the proposed preferences, by any member of >> this list (to start). Everyone is invited to propose as many as it >> wants.=20 > I suggest that you start the ball rolling by posting a list of options > you think we should consider (in a separate discussion topic, please). My area of expertise is not programming, so I can hardly propose what a programmer may find useful to configure. I can only propose what I -personally- find useful (and that list is already done). And I believe this is true for many in the Emacs community; don't we value Emacs incredible plasticity and ability to be adapted to each person's way of thinking and doing?=20 That's why I proposed a *process* to do it: we can all add our voices (all that are interested, at least) and go forward together because we agreed on how to do so.=20 > Let's discuss how to filter and prioritize the options once we have a > provisional list and have an idea about its size. If we do this, we may make a list and then we will stop going forward to discuss how to filter and prioritize. If we agreed on a process, then it's all forward steps until the end of the proposed process (of course anyone can stop and complain at any point, but the probability is smaller and the rest still can go on while we see what happens).=20 Up to now we were unable to do it in the usual way. I only bring another proposal to proceed which is not mine at all, and has been used with success in many other communities.=20 In brief: - We want to flatten a bit the learning wall for newcomers and make emacs more desirable for them, showing in can be not only powerful, but usable from the start and beautiful too. - We agreed that a "wizard" (set of linear steps with clear options on each one) is positive to achieve that objective.=20 - There is a proposal for a process to get a generally agreed list of variables to include in this wizard.=20 - if you find this proposal inadequate please tell me so and I'll just add my personal variables and wait. I have no particular problem with that. - But if you see no particular problem now with the proposed steps, I beg you to consider the possibility of giving it a try, going forward all together. In this case, I will start it in a separate thread and make the work to integrate everything as proposed. I will only ask about some details regarding tools to use for collaboration (and this could be done to the list or with a few people that can help this Emacs newbie in order not to make noise in the list). In each -and any- way, thanks a lot for your kind attention and understanding.=20 Best regards... --=20 eduardo mercovich Donde se cruzan tus talentos=20 con las necesidades del mundo,=20 ah=C3=AD est=C3=A1 tu vocaci=C3=B3n.=20 (An=C3=B3nimo)