From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ihor Radchenko Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs,gmane.emacs.orgmode Subject: bug#65734: [BUG] kill-whole-line on folded subtrees [9.6.8 (release_9.6.8-3-g21171d @ /home/w/usr/emacs/0/29/0/lisp/org/)] Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2024 15:44:29 +0000 Message-ID: <87wmsfj2n6.fsf@localhost> References: <87il8pao4l.fsf@whxvd.name> <87tts8vrpb.fsf@localhost> <83cyyw4of7.fsf@gnu.org> <875y4ovct9.fsf@localhost> <875y04yq9s.fsf@localhost> <875y02y0da.fsf@localhost> <87frz6w2zt.fsf@localhost> <83cyu9nyea.fsf@gnu.org> <87sf35pcds.fsf@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="19890"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: 65734@debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org, manikulin@gmail.com, iota@whxvd.name To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Jan 11 16:42:29 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rNxCO-0004w8-0l for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 16:42:28 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rNxC3-0005b2-6x; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 10:42:07 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rNxC1-0005aR-7G for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 10:42:05 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:5::43]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rNxC0-0006QX-Tc for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 10:42:04 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1rNxBy-0008Gg-4w for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 10:42:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Ihor Radchenko Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2024 15:42:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 65734 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs Original-Received: via spool by 65734-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B65734.170498768631713 (code B ref 65734); Thu, 11 Jan 2024 15:42:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 65734) by debbugs.gnu.org; 11 Jan 2024 15:41:26 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33640 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1rNxBN-0008FR-MJ for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 10:41:25 -0500 Original-Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]:43271) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1rNxBK-0008F7-C0 for 65734@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 10:41:23 -0500 Original-Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4DC7D240103 for <65734@debbugs.gnu.org>; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 16:41:19 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1704987679; bh=JqgIoFx+kgDSyPR0xevPd4K7yAZAwlBrvTn7xgbyRXM=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:From; b=AvNwaaHfJegCNRlMKXORt7+yrs8FfEGoI7gT3Nf45ZCm04bzb/RCqUhVjkuUGxKaG x0+6KWj7hKDAYUBUiYk2SFw0m3286ciJmrq4/f+l31mubUkMlPrv7kPzdNYy38kcZl hV7a2RBvz9sLBsFgZjd4hb89DTGNzllePyyPTQM1qbFQH0GNUQ7EuAs7WbEdu++30W FB8+kF3knMZtY4lQWWtXlBJZqatYzDoiaQII0H+Lnjddty9Pzr5HI8APdoF1hVhitv HTku5nZE279pLxkxmfAab/z436zFWu8SXAIDd+B49rEUVGhyvyKhjKd3uEG4EON6II Jom9VsxbxzihA== Original-Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4T9pmZ42D3z6txQ; Thu, 11 Jan 2024 16:41:17 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:277910 gmane.emacs.orgmode:158995 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier writes: >>> I said that remapping widely-used keys to commands that behave >>> significantly differently places a non-trivial burden on users, >>> especially on those who use the remapping mode relatively rarely. >> >> Sure. From which I concluded that Org mode should avoid remapping > > I don't think that's what it means. It means that it depends on what is > the end-user-visible effect. If the remapped version of the command > "does the same" conceptually, then it's OK (even more so if the > non-remapped version of the command ends up misbehaving). Ok. I stand corrected. > I think the main question is: can we expect that some users out there > will want to use the non-remapped version of the command because they > prefer its behavior? We received no bug reports complaining about non-standard behaviour of remapped functions AFAIK. So, I do not think that Org mode has problems here. -- Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . 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Thu, 11 Jan 2024 16:41:17 +0100 (CET) From: Ihor Radchenko To: Stefan Monnier Cc: Eli Zaretskii , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org, 65734@debbugs.gnu.org, manikulin@gmail.com, iota@whxvd.name Subject: Re: bug#65734: [BUG] kill-whole-line on folded subtrees [9.6.8 (release_9.6.8-3-g21171d @ /home/w/usr/emacs/0/29/0/lisp/org/)] In-Reply-To: References: <87il8pao4l.fsf@whxvd.name> <87tts8vrpb.fsf@localhost> <83cyyw4of7.fsf@gnu.org> <875y4ovct9.fsf@localhost> <875y04yq9s.fsf@localhost> <875y02y0da.fsf@localhost> <87frz6w2zt.fsf@localhost> <83cyu9nyea.fsf@gnu.org> <87sf35pcds.fsf@localhost> Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2024 15:44:29 +0000 Message-ID: <87wmsfj2n6.fsf@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Scanner: mx12.migadu.com X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 64C1212B09 X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -9.47 X-Spam-Score: -9.47 X-TUID: MZ9dxE2pxd6f Stefan Monnier writes: >>> I said that remapping widely-used keys to commands that behave >>> significantly differently places a non-trivial burden on users, >>> especially on those who use the remapping mode relatively rarely. >> >> Sure. From which I concluded that Org mode should avoid remapping > > I don't think that's what it means. It means that it depends on what is > the end-user-visible effect. If the remapped version of the command > "does the same" conceptually, then it's OK (even more so if the > non-remapped version of the command ends up misbehaving). Ok. I stand corrected. > I think the main question is: can we expect that some users out there > will want to use the non-remapped version of the command because they > prefer its behavior? We received no bug reports complaining about non-standard behaviour of remapped functions AFAIK. So, I do not think that Org mode has problems here. -- Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at