From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Mathieu Lirzin Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#21998: Is it time to drop ChangeLogs? Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2016 01:22:11 +0100 Message-ID: <87vb4zb0i4.fsf__8519.85152480683$1457310200$gmane$org@gnu.org> References: <56BE7E37.3090708@cs.ucla.edu> <4hd1rw1ubr.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83vb50wxhv.fsf@gnu.org> <87y49vz4cg.fsf@acer.localhost.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1457310200 32017 80.91.229.3 (7 Mar 2016 00:23:20 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2016 00:23:20 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 21998@debbugs.gnu.org, Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen To: Emacs developers Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Mar 07 01:23:09 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1acix3-0005Er-H0 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 07 Mar 2016 01:23:09 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52679 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1acix2-0001eB-G6 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:23:08 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:51393) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aciwy-0001dt-Oe for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:23:05 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aciww-0001YJ-Fj for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:23:04 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:40008) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aciww-0001YE-D5 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:23:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84) (envelope-from ) id 1aciww-0005tP-6n for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:23:02 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Mathieu Lirzin Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2016 00:23:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 21998 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 21998-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B21998.145731014722596 (code B ref 21998); Mon, 07 Mar 2016 00:23:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 21998) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Mar 2016 00:22:27 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37135 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84) (envelope-from ) id 1aciwN-0005sO-Lq for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:22:27 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:59960) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84) (envelope-from ) id 1aciwL-0005sB-NI for 21998@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:22:25 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aciwB-0001Ki-K2 for 21998@debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:22:20 -0500 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:60531) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aciwB-0001Kd-Gy; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:22:15 -0500 Original-Received: from mek33-4-82-236-46-88.fbx.proxad.net ([82.236.46.88]:57400 helo=godel) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1aciwA-00085U-UA; Sun, 06 Mar 2016 19:22:15 -0500 In-Reply-To: (John Wiegley's message of "Sun, 06 Mar 2016 13:52:04 -0800") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:114522 Archived-At: Hi, John Wiegley writes: > On Sun, Mar 06 2016 13:07 (-0800), John Wiegley wrote: >> >> I have always wanted to drop the ChangeLogs, so if the other developers agree, >> I'm all for it. Keeping ChangeLog style in the commit entry is not terribly >> useful either, since the diff output of log -p lets you know which function or >> variable is being modified. I've never missed not having that ChangeLog data >> in other projects, of any size. But that's up to the other developers and what >> makes their lives easier. > > I'd like to open this up to discussion on emacs-devel, so that we hear from > our other developers. What do you all think about ChangeLogs, and their value > to you in your work on Emacs? Discussing such thing seems reasonable. However I don't think any decision should be made by Emacs developpers on their own. Change Logs are part of the GCS so relaxing their requirement should be made at a GNU level instead. In my short experience, Change Logs has generally been useful both when reading and composing them. When writing them it helps me structure large changes in logical commits that are modelled by the Change Log format. Finally It helps me being precise in my wordings which is not trivial for non-native english speakers. On a more spiritual side, I think they belong to the zen of contributing to a GNU project. :) -- Mathieu Lirzin