From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Emanuel Berg Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: [External] : Running emacs without any customisation Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2022 17:59:00 +0200 Message-ID: <87v8onzpdn.fsf@dataswamp.org> References: <871qrceb1r.fsf@yahoo.com> <87sfjscquz.fsf@yahoo.com> <874jw81bzy.fsf@dataswamp.org> <2dyTCubii5MXGOBNOfmeFmh8mjr1P1pTI9Hry_CXqQLmzwu1Ed8gtIJarhmb9mNiUvo5NUZjYj_1VjS0fq_7JVS2UaCdmZryrdmk3wXhTiU=@proton.me> <87v8onc2yc.fsf@yahoo.com> <87k053c0zx.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="31650"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:RysLmODJyLyaIF8f4MwhSIxojOg= Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Oct 14 17:06:59 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1ojMH4-00081x-AL for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2022 17:06:58 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41642 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1ojMH3-0002Gq-5u for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 14 Oct 2022 11:06:57 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44414) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oj0c8-0004IV-Ez for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 11:59:16 -0400 Original-Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]:42640) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1oj0c4-0000Eu-Lx for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 11:59:16 -0400 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1oj0c0-0005bz-Lf for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 13 Oct 2022 17:59:08 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Mail-Followup-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Mail-Copies-To: never Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: -15 X-Spam_score: -1.6 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 14 Oct 2022 11:03:38 -0400 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:139935 Archived-At: uzibalqa wrote: >>> What I see, is a stumbling block that experienced people >>> can't get passed because they are being limited by the >>> past, that things have been this way for decades. I do not >>> see the great designers like Guy Steele or Richard >>> Stallman at their prime anymore. >> >> Here, you're seeing the work of the great designer Joel >> McCormack, of Digital WSL, at his prime. > > That was in the 70's. Who are the equivalent people today? One can never answer where the "equivalent people" are in a meaningful way. One cannot compare between fields and one cannot compare one decade to another - well, this makes for fun magazine articles perhaps, but it's just bogus if one looks for a real answer in it. So don't do that! That said, I think it's safe to say today's people are as good or better in terms of technology: "development has gone forward" as the tautology goes ... But: was this more easy, or more difficult to do? Did it require less, or more brilliance? Those questions do not compute ... Also note that the "70s people", if active still, are also as much "today's people" as any 20 year old! The first programmer in the world was probably some shaman in a cave. He would cut symbol's out of the stone wall, then inhale toxic fumes from the fireplace, and eat mushrooms he had carefully collected in the wood. Then he would stare on the inscriptions on the wall until he collapsed of mental and physical fatigue - the program had then executed in his head, and when he awoke with a big grin on his face he would have found the answer to his question ... Now, if you would grab him from the stone age to OUR age and say, "Yes, uhm ... so today we don't use the cave wall anymore, and not the fire either actually! Instead we have an editor and a compiler, here, take a look ..." probably he would just say, " ... okay!" and the next time you'd see him he would stare into the monitor in deep thought writing code ... -- underground experts united https://dataswamp.org/~incal