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From: David Engster <deng@randomsample.de>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
Cc: bzg@gnu.org, monnier@IRO.UMontreal.CA, emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Generating the ChangeLog files from the commit messages
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2014 17:19:30 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87tx1ssezx.fsf@engster.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <83egsw50rr.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 21 Nov 2014 12:03:04 +0200")

Eli Zaretskii writes:
>> From: David Engster <deng@randomsample.de>
>> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2014 23:51:11 +0100
>> Cc: Bastien <bzg@gnu.org>, emacs-devel@gnu.org
>> 
>> >     <changelog-style details>
>> 
>> That's precisely what I'd drop. It's just a verbose diff.
>
> No, it's a summary of diffs.  As such, it many times presents a
> bird-eye view that is hard to grasp by looking at the diffs.

Well, this is also because our commits are often too large.

> It is also much shorter, so if you want to decide whether a particular
> changeset is of interest, you have much less text to read.

A good commit title is often enough to raise interest. This entails a
location prefix to mark which area of the code is affected, so that the
person who maintains that area can immediately see it, filter by it,
etc.

As I've said: the Changelog is not completely useless. But most of its
information is automatically generated from the diff. Just go through
the log and in your mind strip all the generated stuff (like filenames
and affected symbols), and see what information provided by the *author*
actually remains - it's usually very little, and often stating the
obvious, instead of saying *why* something was done. This is not
primarily the author's fault: since you have to break down your changes
function by function, you often cannot really describe the broader
picture these changes accomplish, so you just do the mandatory
book-keeping.

This makes our commit logs mostly useless for actually understanding how
code evolved. You may feel differently, but keep in mind there are not
many people who know the Emacs code base as well as you do. When I dig
into files which are unfamiliar to me (like recently into compile.el),
and hit 'l' on an annotated line, it's usually a pretty frustrating
experience.

I encourage anyone to browse through the commit logs from projects like
Git or Linux. If people then still tell me that our style is superior,
so be it.

-David



  reply	other threads:[~2014-11-21 16:19 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 90+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2014-11-14 14:39 Include necessary git tools in the Emacs distribution? Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-11-14 14:57 ` Tassilo Horn
2014-11-14 14:58 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-11-14 16:13 ` Ulrich Mueller
2014-11-15 19:28   ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-11-15 20:04     ` Ulrich Mueller
2014-11-15 20:07       ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-11-15 20:34         ` Kelvin White
2014-11-15 20:35           ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-11-15 20:57             ` Ulrich Mueller
2014-11-15 21:45         ` Glenn Morris
2014-11-16  0:01         ` Lennart Borgman
2014-11-18  2:07   ` Rüdiger Sonderfeld
2014-11-18  2:15     ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-18 14:45       ` Generating the ChangeLog files from the commit messages (was: Include necessary git tools in the Emacs distribution?) Stefan Monnier
2014-11-18 14:59         ` Generating the ChangeLog files from the commit messages Ted Zlatanov
2014-11-18 16:22           ` Rüdiger Sonderfeld
2014-11-18 17:10         ` Glenn Morris
2014-11-18 17:40           ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-11-18 17:56             ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-18 20:32               ` Thien-Thi Nguyen
2014-11-18 21:12             ` Stefan Monnier
2014-11-18 22:05               ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-19 22:36                 ` Richard Stallman
2014-11-20  0:15                   ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-20  2:50                     ` Yuri Khan
2014-11-20  3:15                       ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-20  4:04                         ` Yuri Khan
2014-11-20 20:12                           ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-21  4:25                             ` Kelvin White
2014-11-21  7:57                               ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-19  9:03               ` Bastien
2014-11-19  9:11               ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-11-29 22:35               ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-30  0:23                 ` Jan D.
2014-11-30  9:12                 ` Jorgen Schaefer
2014-11-30 16:15                   ` Paul Eggert
2014-11-30 18:11                     ` Stefan Monnier
2014-11-30 18:23                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-11-30 18:30                         ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-11-30 20:32                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-11-30 21:50                           ` default large-file-warning-threshold (was: Generating the ChangeLog files ...) Paul Eggert
2014-11-30 23:19                             ` default large-file-warning-threshold Óscar Fuentes
2014-11-30 23:22                               ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-11-30 23:31                                 ` Óscar Fuentes
2014-12-01  5:46                                   ` Paul Eggert
2014-12-01 15:52                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-12-01 18:13                                       ` Paul Eggert
2014-12-01 18:19                                         ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-12-01 18:24                                           ` Paul Eggert
2014-12-01 20:21                                           ` Ted Zlatanov
2014-12-01 20:32                                             ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-12-02  1:17                                               ` Ted Zlatanov
2014-12-02  5:07                                                 ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-12-01 19:00                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-12-01 17:06                                 ` Achim Gratz
2014-12-01 17:56                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-12-01 18:33                                     ` David Kastrup
2014-12-01 19:12                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-12-01 19:15                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-12-01 20:47                                   ` Rasmus
2014-12-01 19:15                             ` default large-file-warning-threshold (was: Generating the ChangeLog files ...) Richard Stallman
2014-12-02  5:15                             ` default large-file-warning-threshold Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-12-01  3:24                         ` Generating the ChangeLog files from the commit messages Stefan Monnier
2014-12-01  3:39                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-12-01  5:49                           ` Paul Eggert
2014-12-01  7:45                           ` H. Dieter Wilhelm
2014-11-30 16:35                 ` Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen
2014-11-19  9:02           ` Bastien
2014-11-19  9:38             ` Rasmus
2014-11-19 11:17               ` Bastien
2014-11-19 13:34                 ` Óscar Fuentes
2014-11-19 13:50                   ` Bastien
2014-11-19 16:29                 ` Yuri Khan
2014-11-19 16:43                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-11-19 16:52                     ` Yuri Khan
2014-11-19 18:49                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-11-20  2:54                         ` Yuri Khan
2014-11-20  9:38                           ` Bastien
2014-11-20  9:33                         ` Bastien
2014-11-20  9:31                   ` Bastien
2014-11-19 16:43             ` David Engster
2014-11-19 22:21               ` Stefan Monnier
2014-11-19 22:51                 ` David Engster
2014-11-21 10:03                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-11-21 16:19                     ` David Engster [this message]
2014-11-21 16:58                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-11-21 17:19                         ` Stefan Monnier
2014-11-21 17:21                         ` David Engster
2014-11-19 16:54     ` Include necessary git tools in the Emacs distribution? David Engster

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