gnuplot (was: Re: zsh outside of Emacs)

gnuplot (was: Re: zsh outside of Emacs)

[Emanuel Berg]

(on topic: gnuplot - last paragraph!)

torys.anderson@gmail.com (Tory S. Anderson) writes:

>> It is not only a matter of copy and paste back and
>> forth! If that is your only concern the whole
>> system is integrated as it is. No, if you have any
>> data in an Emacs buffer, you can immediately put
>> all of Emacs to work on that data, just as you can
>> put all of Emacs to (re)produce it. And this can be
>> automatized big with no glue in between. Now that
>> sounded really advanced but it can be really down
>> to Earth things. You will experience the benefits
>> of an integrated interface with common input
>> methods and documentation/configuration very soon
>> if you didn't already.
>
> Emanuel puts it well; that sort of integrated
> interface and the ability to put emacs tools to use
> on my bash output has served me many, many times.

Thanks for the compliment. You know what they say: a
great Useneter always have one last great post left in
his tank...

Yes, integration is one of the top three or four
benefits of Emacs. To me, it is the most enjoyable
with mail/Usenet (Gnus), then the web (Emacs-w3m), and
only then manpages and the shell. But it depends what
you do, of course, where you are the most benefited.

> It's hard for me to go back to a "dumb terminal" (to
> use the term ironically) now...

Indeed, you never want to take a step back from what
you have achieved. And that can be a problem whenever
you cannot decide what to use... (a "problem" as in
frustration)

Uncanny, by the way, your mention of a "dumb
terminal"! Just before I read your post I did a
gnuplot .gpi file and added a 'set terminal dumb' line
for fast ASCII-only checks. Speaking of gnuplot, I had
to to get gnuplot-mode from MELPA - that was super
easy, but why isn't such a basic mode included in
vanilla Emacs, to offer font lock, indentation, and
invocation? For the few of you who don't know gnuplot
this can serve as an introduction [1] - the Makefile
got a bit complicated, but it isn't anything a
computer literate person cannot decipher in zero time.
Gnuplot is great and can be used not just for
techno-techno-science but for writing, journalism, and
plain cool facts just as well. It should definitely be
associated with Emacs from the holster in all ways
possible, is what I think.

[1] http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573/hs-linux/docs/report/pics/plot

-- 
underground experts united

Re: gnuplot (was: Re: zsh outside of Emacs)

[Robert Thorpe]

Emanuel Berg <embe8573@student.uu.se> writes:

> for fast ASCII-only checks. Speaking of gnuplot, I had
> to to get gnuplot-mode from MELPA - that was super
> easy, but why isn't such a basic mode included in
> vanilla Emacs, to offer font lock, indentation, and
> invocation? For the few of you who don't know gnuplot

Perhaps because the authors haven't copyright assigned it to the FSF?
The name "gnuplot" is a coincidence, the program and it's authors have
nothing to do with the GNU project.  That's not to say it's not a great
program, it is.

BR,
Robert Thorpe

Re: gnuplot (was: Re: zsh outside of Emacs)

[Emanuel Berg]

Robert Thorpe <rt@robertthorpeconsulting.com> writes:

>> for fast ASCII-only checks. Speaking of gnuplot, I
>> had to to get gnuplot-mode from MELPA - that was
>> super easy, but why isn't such a basic mode
>> included in vanilla Emacs, to offer font lock,
>> indentation, and invocation? For the few of you who
>> don't know gnuplot
>
> Perhaps because the authors haven't copyright
> assigned it to the FSF? The name "gnuplot" is a
> coincidence, the program and it's authors have
> nothing to do with the GNU project. That's not to
> say it's not a great program, it is.

Do you mean gnuplot-mode has a missing/conflicting
license, or gnuplot has? With gnuplot that should be
OK as there are built-in modes for God knows what
technologies that most likely have licenses all over
the place, including none at all.

-- 
underground experts united

Re: gnuplot (was: Re: zsh outside of Emacs)

[Robert Thorpe]

Emanuel Berg <embe8573@student.uu.se> writes:
...
>
> Do you mean gnuplot-mode has a missing/conflicting
> license, or gnuplot has? With gnuplot that should be
> OK as there are built-in modes for God knows what
> technologies that most likely have licenses all over
> the place, including none at all.

I don't know why it's not included.

Possible reasons:
* The Emacs developers don't think it's important enough.
* It has a non GPL license.
* The Emacs developers can't get copyright assignment for it.

The FSF generally require that Emacs coders assign copyright to them.
Unless it's a small change it's not considered good enough to just use
the GPLv3 license.  As far as I understand it, there are two reasons for
that.  Firstly, it enables them to easily re-license the code.  That
could happen if a legal flaw is found in a license, for example GPLv3
was created to rectify problems with GPLv2.  The other advantage is that
it prevents programmers from being able to relicense their contributions
and request that they're removed.

What sometimes happens is that an elisp package is initially unpopular.
But, the author gathers contributions from many people.  Then the
package becomes popular and people want it in the core or ELPA.  But by
that time the author can't find all the people to contact to ask for
copyright paperwork, or there are so many of them that it isn't
practical.

You could try asking for it to be included in the core it may be
possible.

BR,
Robert Thorpe

Re: gnuplot (was: Re: zsh outside of Emacs)

[Emanuel Berg]

Robert Thorpe <rt@robertthorpeconsulting.com> writes:

> You could try asking for it to be included in the
> core it may be possible.

If there are complications, I don't have a problem
with the current state. It is no big deal. If a person
is intelligent enough to find both Emacs and gnuplot
then I have confidence [s]he will be able to use MELPA
to get the mode as well.

-- 
underground experts united