From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Taylor Venable Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A wish, a plea Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 20:36:44 -0400 Message-ID: <87sl8kzuxv.fsf@lionel.localdomain> References: <4679F561.4030600@hacksaw.org> <467AC9AC.7060604@gmail.com> <878xacmyfg.fsf@red-bean.com> <87odj9ruby.fsf@kanga.tapsellferrier.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1182472624 4333 80.91.229.12 (22 Jun 2007 00:37:04 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2007 00:37:04 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Karl Fogel , emacs-devel@gnu.org, "Lennart Borgman \(gmail\)" , Hacksaw To: Nic James Ferrier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jun 22 02:37:02 2007 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1I1X92-0005qp-VT for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 22 Jun 2007 02:37:01 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1I1X92-000247-Hz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 20:37:00 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1I1X8z-00023r-At for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 20:36:57 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1I1X8y-00023f-K9 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 20:36:56 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1I1X8y-00023c-EN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 20:36:56 -0400 Original-Received: from mout.perfora.net ([74.208.4.194]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1I1X8y-0006L0-1c for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 20:36:56 -0400 Original-Received: from [71.97.203.207] (helo=lionel.localdomain.metasyntax.net) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrus0) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp8S-1I1X8n1ixp-0002uX; Thu, 21 Jun 2007 20:36:52 -0400 In-Reply-To: <87odj9ruby.fsf@kanga.tapsellferrier.co.uk> (Nic James Ferrier's message of "Thu\, 21 Jun 2007 20\:17\:05 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus 5.11 / Emacs 23.0.0.1 / Linux 2.6.20 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX196POfTJ6T+u8v+TtvWUvATiMVaNxdSxLtYaOm m2HE4jlb/8GMyaNHlZuS8tsvjddlc8RivFIwDhL6NxpY1sOWVV XLF8CN3MTIc0plcicat5g== X-detected-kernel: Linux 2.6? (barebone, rare!) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:73572 Archived-At: Nic James Ferrier writes: > Karl Fogel writes: > >> Emacs gives the user total control, but that does not diminish the >> importance of choosing reasonable defaults. The current *scratch* >> buffer is a punitive default; Hacksaw is suggesting that we choose >> another default. > > I agree. > > I don't use it as a default. > > I really do use *scratch* for all sorts of things. But it shouldn't be > the default. > > Maybe a ~/notes or ~/.emacs.d/notes ? As far as ~/notes goes, what if it already exists? And doesn't have anything to do with Emacs? If I started Emacs for the first time and saw some seemingly random text file, I'd be confused. An empty buffer, on the other hand, may not be a bad idea. Maybe in fundamental mode. I actually don't have a problem with *scratch* because I see it as kind of a starting area. Emacs isn't second-guessing what I want to do, it's very close to having a blank slate. In fact, it's a lot like booting your computer -- once it loads you've got the whole command set available to you. If you want to write a file, read your email, or play Tetris, it's up to you to input the command to do so. And besides, I do use *scratch* frequently to work on various smaller Emacs customizations. My counter-wish (and plea) would be that if any changes are made to the default behavior, that an option be added to ensure that my *scratch* is dutifully created each time I load Emacs. Best regards. -- Taylor Venable taylor@metasyntax.net http://www.metasyntax.net/