From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: State of the repository conversion Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2014 09:08:32 +0900 Message-ID: <87siqdiven.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: <20140319175124.BCCB3380835@snark.thyrsus.com> <83wqfq82ge.fsf@gnu.org> <20140319185416.GA25588@thyrsus.com> <83siqe80bj.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1395274136 8251 80.91.229.3 (20 Mar 2014 00:08:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2014 00:08:56 +0000 (UTC) Cc: esr@thyrsus.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Mar 20 01:09:05 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1WQQXf-0004Me-Cj for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 20 Mar 2014 01:09:03 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44399 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WQQXe-0006xc-TO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 19 Mar 2014 20:09:02 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:45868) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WQQXT-0006vr-Gl for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 19 Mar 2014 20:08:58 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WQQXM-0007ER-7O for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 19 Mar 2014 20:08:51 -0400 Original-Received: from mgmt2.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp ([130.158.97.224]:48984) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WQQXD-0007CD-E6; Wed, 19 Mar 2014 20:08:35 -0400 Original-Received: from uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp [130.158.99.156]) by mgmt2.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E7B59708AF; Thu, 20 Mar 2014 09:08:32 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: by uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 7B0311A28DC; Thu, 20 Mar 2014 09:08:32 +0900 (JST) In-Reply-To: <83siqe80bj.fsf@gnu.org> X-Mailer: VM undefined under 21.5 (beta34) "kale" 2a0f42961ed4 XEmacs Lucid (x86_64-unknown-linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 130.158.97.224 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:170582 Archived-At: About the workflow, Eli Zaretskii writes: > It is better to draw upon the knowhow and experience of veteran git > users among us to identify in advance the preferred workflows, And the resulting recommendations will be ignored in favor of the convenience of the powers that be, as the recommendations for Bazaar were. (And mostly, so were such recommendations ignored when Python converted from Subversion to Mercurial.) I don't know about Eric's experience (he's participated in a lot more of these than I have), but I suspect at least subconsciously he's thinking the same thing. Please remember what that convenience boiled down to: "don't change anything that doesn't need to change, because the current workflow works fine for us". I admit I was wrong to suggest "the workflows that work in other projects." Experience showed that people adopted those workflows as needed for their own work, but many people continued to use Bazaar as if it were CVS. It's only a tiny bit harder to use git that way (no bound branches or lightweight checkouts, so you do have to learn to push, and merge from upstream if your push wouldn't be a fast-forward). But people are used to the up-to-date check failing, I suspect, and it's not that hard to learn -- everybody did learn in the bad old days of CVS. So it amounts to learning that you need to "git push" after "git commit", if you were using a checkout with Bazaar. People who do want to use git as a free-branching distributed VCS already know how to do that, and they may or may not follow "recommended" workflows themselves. So I think this is really a non-problem. Just translate bzr commands to the git equivalents, configure public repos to prevent "destructive" commands (require fast-forward pushes, mostly), and let the git fans teach those who want to improve their git skills as issues come up. Emacs doesn't have much structure in its abstract workflow (it basically comes down to "hack, save, push") that requires careful consideration of VCS operations.