From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Oleh Krehel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Calling (package-initialize) sooner during initialization Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 09:25:31 +0200 Message-ID: <87sibkemtw.fsf@gmail.com> References: <87383xk4ia.fsf@taylan.uni.cx> <87d22zi69k.fsf@taylan.uni.cx> <87a8xtoq3a.fsf@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1430206331 16979 80.91.229.3 (28 Apr 2015 07:32:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 07:32:11 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Andy Moreton Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Apr 28 09:31:56 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Ymzzm-0003fi-1K for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 28 Apr 2015 09:31:54 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59200 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Ymzzk-0006UF-QR for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 28 Apr 2015 03:31:52 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:40779) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YmzzK-0005w9-SU for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 28 Apr 2015 03:31:27 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YmzzH-0004Dh-Nb for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 28 Apr 2015 03:31:26 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wg0-x234.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c00::234]:35505) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YmzzH-0004Cy-H5 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 28 Apr 2015 03:31:23 -0400 Original-Received: by wgyo15 with SMTP id o15so140955527wgy.2 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 2015 00:31:22 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-type; bh=q4fQIHkjYNE55xtfNsdKnvAJOD4C9VUxTQtlaBak+LU=; b=pRr0vwLeYpShOmkekI5TUOX6OP+M5o+xc2gX8tgASTkh/38DQUluKxqv9/Ur86y31q guc0gVyPCWt46PjQYYLB/5MRZNZUWgrFcwpX7JhLcBjeGNsvvT+S6sE5A88Q5hOoHoLB K5MJAYG87/J08GVrJPAuXPEk17nIwh5so0dzYnQRxwl/wJV9VRFRuz3T1A+KLSRmGvH1 AOKyUHKcucwA5FblJbNye0+t7w75y8tn3NWYB2j8HtPVrL9SSEDWPVWkOxbAJLGrIr9j UG5GyXzt53nKEMcWdYpyQIarse0m8zKtSbpek9KtYQPI9UyKclJlXKx1PKw1T5Tp/yzm MFtA== X-Received: by 10.180.76.205 with SMTP id m13mr26877888wiw.19.1430206282795; Tue, 28 Apr 2015 00:31:22 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from firefly (dyn069045.nbw.tue.nl. [131.155.69.45]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id go4sm14997776wib.1.2015.04.28.00.31.21 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 28 Apr 2015 00:31:21 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: (Andy Moreton's message of "Mon, 27 Apr 2015 14:43:00 +0100") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.5 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c00::234 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:185948 Archived-At: Andy Moreton writes: > On Mon 27 Apr 2015, Stefan Monnier wrote: > >>> Why don't you write to the custom-file (and make the use of custom-file >>> the default instead of writing custom settings in .emacs by default) ? >> >> When should the custom-file be loaded? Before .emacs is too early. >> After .emacs is too late. > > Never - because customise is horrible :-) > > I agree that emacs should not modify the user init file: it was > misguided to allow customise to do so, and customise should always have > used a separate file. I super-agree on this point. I even switched to using this macro, just to prevent customize from writing stuff to my .emacs (which normally is a one-liner): (defmacro csetq (variable value) `(funcall (or (get ',variable 'custom-set) 'set-default) ',variable ,value)) (csetq tool-bar-mode nil) (csetq menu-bar-mode nil) ... It works out pretty well, basically Customize isn't aware that I've modified anything. So when something does get saved (I think recently package.el saved something like a list of installed packages), I see only that one thing, instead of a horrible blob of 100 variables. That's a lot more manageable. Oleh