From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Emanuel Berg via Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Emacs i18n Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2021 13:16:38 +0200 Message-ID: <87sg07c3xl.fsf@zoho.eu> References: <87r1fscb0o.fsf@zoho.eu> <14151570.3RPpvrhc5F@galex-713.eu> Reply-To: Emanuel Berg Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="22076"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:8Kd7caA0w55Wq1VCfHpI4HmjAp8= Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Jul 21 13:22:26 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1m6AJ0-0005ZC-9G for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 21 Jul 2021 13:22:26 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59794 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m6AIz-00033N-BG for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 21 Jul 2021 07:22:25 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:34824) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m6AIe-00030R-9P for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Jul 2021 07:22:04 -0400 Original-Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]:44516) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1m6AIc-0000J1-Kl for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Jul 2021 07:22:04 -0400 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1m6ADd-0007s0-Ol for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 21 Jul 2021 13:16:53 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Mail-Followup-To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Mail-Copies-To: never Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: -16 X-Spam_score: -1.7 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.7 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.248, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "help-gnu-emacs" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.help:131945 Archived-At: Alexandre Garreau wrote: > you say “why would people put themselves at disadvantage” > while not everyone lives with unique main purpose to be “the > best”, and not doing an effort to be above some level is not > “purposedly putting oneself at disadvantage”. Ah, "the best", you don't have to aim for that to be benefited, but if you aim for at least one of the better versions of yourself, that's honorable! When I was healthy physically and mentally, I aimed for the say top 5% best version of myself, now I have both been forced and learned to take life less seriously, so say I now aim for a top 20% version of myself or something like that, It is just a digit; but yes, let me say this, if we are talking young people and young adults in an education and/or technology setting, most definitely they should do as I and aim for the top 5% of themselves or even higher if that's their inclination, absolutely, and if they find people to compete with in a healthy and balanced way - I mean, it doesn't matter what I say, this is already what happens everywhere anyway - GO FOR IT, and most definitely their ambitions should include mastering English good enough for all practical purposes and situations they will encounter in their careers as practitioners, craftsmen, athletes, family members, all of it, human beings! People are certainly not perfect and that includes me but I did at least some good things, that said I'm confident the generations younger than me will beat me without any super-human effort from their part :) > you say restricting oneself to a non-english language is > stupid hence translating from english is stupid, but as we > already said, many people *already speak english* and yet > prefer to read in their native language, and yet a book in > english might be a barrieer. A ~1000 pages book might be > considered difficult to begin with, if it’s in the native > language it will be deemed a lot easier. Same for manuals, > references, etc. But how long will it take to translate it? How much money and how many man hours, how much skill? Why waste it on something that will help a very small group of people, and then only marginally (it's debatable, if they are benefited even, as said)? All this to offer something that is already there in its original, intended form and will take what, 1-2 years to translate, typeset, print, ship? Something that the proposed audience could just grab without delay and with nothing "lost in translation", literally, if they would just master English? Which they should do anyway if they have any ambitions in a field where English is so dominant, actually even more so than everywhere else, where English happens to also be completely dominant? Does this make any sense to you? -- underground experts united https://dataswamp.org/~incal