From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Karl Fogel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#15746: 24.3; [PATCH] bookmark should confirm when overwrite Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 23:31:50 -0500 Message-ID: <87r4b35qh5.fsf@floss.red-bean.com> References: <87iowg9bqw.fsf@floss.red-bean.com> <87ob677qcb.fsf@floss.red-bean.com> Reply-To: Karl Fogel NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1383107594 17712 80.91.229.3 (30 Oct 2013 04:33:14 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 04:33:14 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 15746@debbugs.gnu.org, Leo Liu To: Drew Adams Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Oct 30 05:33:17 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VbNT2-0000xV-QP for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 30 Oct 2013 05:33:17 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50482 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VbNT2-0005Sw-Ce for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:33:16 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:56510) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VbNSu-0005Sm-3S for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:33:13 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VbNSo-0002Oi-PO for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:33:08 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:37902) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VbNSo-0002Oe-L1 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:33:02 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VbNSo-0000rP-9Y for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:33:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Karl Fogel Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2013 04:33:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 15746 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: patch Original-Received: via spool by 15746-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B15746.13831075213227 (code B ref 15746); Wed, 30 Oct 2013 04:33:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 15746) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Oct 2013 04:32:01 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51921 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VbNRo-0000ps-EY for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:32:00 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-ie0-f179.google.com ([209.85.223.179]:42384) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VbNRm-0000pb-06 for 15746@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 30 Oct 2013 00:31:58 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-ie0-f179.google.com with SMTP id aq17so1435681iec.10 for <15746@debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 29 Oct 2013 21:31:52 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:from:to:cc:subject:references:reply-to:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-type; bh=KgqkHFJhPVBkK+tnpX05vqDm/XofPfMEVPKtaJa4PC8=; b=ibDKKKqOW92sB6pB2f9tm+rsSinjIA0+bNf4vV6tbDE1yalARia2dtD2t1tV0ssePu MuBgzc4NbitUXzm6Se/eugwscb6f6JhvqK1wUL8+nKCwHK9aTcdp3TwP3j24mmaj6ft1 b2Fu1uBbabGs+FMdjWBfShVbyWYcFL4+Kx9XHEL2aNCeOed+whEoH5AUQTTest7g5c+K HlBRrvtDF+0wmpV5SUmzC5ROcSBZjdLcvIsuNgHe/kORQUhhQhrS4XSsl3dxJF8jUBOY Cwqsf1GRn0CjW+EVCeBb4X41O0k6ZGXZLjN2KAI/BELjEjxepD+tCIpn8NsoNjSbKmEp 9jhw== X-Received: by 10.50.136.137 with SMTP id qa9mr893791igb.42.1383107512123; Tue, 29 Oct 2013 21:31:52 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from floss.red-bean.com (50-200-5-118-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net. [50.200.5.118]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id ft2sm5223441igb.5.2013.10.29.21.31.51 for (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 29 Oct 2013 21:31:51 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: (Drew Adams's message of "Tue, 29 Oct 2013 15:16:02 -0700 (PDT)") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.50 (gnu/linux) X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:79779 Archived-At: Drew Adams writes: >You seem to be turning things around, as if the proposal gave users >a choice and I were arguing against that or I were arguing only >about a different default behavior. Look at the proposed patch, >please. Oh, sure, I saw the patch. I saw it as a starting point; subsequent discussion (before my mail, IIRC) turned to the question of providing a customizeable behavior, so that both ways were available. In any case, I assumed that potential customization was so obvious we were clearly just talking about the question of what the default should be. I see now that I should have made that assumption more explicit, however. >It seems that you have not recognized the silent-update use case, >and so have not understood why the proposed change would be >annoying, hence why users need a choice here. I hope you understand >it now. Actually, no -- not only do I recognize it, it is the majority use case for me as well. I just don't think it's good as a default, that's all. >No. A variable is not user friendly. There should be two different >commands, bound to two different keys. It is about different use >cases - for different contexts. It is not about different users, >some of whom always want silent updating and some of whom always >want confirmation querying. That's another solution, hmmm, but it seems to me it complexifies the user interface a bit (it adds another binding in the keyspace, which the user then cannot avoid encountering when looking at the available bound commands -- whereas a variable is something they only need to deal with if/when they go looking for it, read the documentation, etc). So I'm not sure which way is better; I think we might be down to the "tyranny of small differences" at that point :-). >Providing a variable as the only means to silently update does >not provide equal flexibility. > >There is no need for a discussion about defaults (except for which >command goes on which key), if you provide two different commands >bound to two different keys. And that really *does* provide >"equal flexibility". As far as that assertion goes, it is true, yes. It doesn't address the keyspace complexity issue. I guess I'll ponder, and then commit some patch. It need not be the final patch, but 90% of the code is the same either way and I'd like to get that part into the codebase so we can discuss the other 10%. Best, -K