Re: Emacs as word processor

[Christopher Allan Webber <cwebber@dustycloud.org>]

rms@gnu.org writes:

> 25 years ago I hoped we would extend Emacs to do WYSIWG word
> processing.  That is why we added text properties and variable width
> fonts.  However, more features are still needed to achieve this.
>
> Could people please start working on the features that are needed?

I'd love to have this also, for two different reasons.

 - It would be nice to be able to open and edit LibreOffice ODT
   files in emacs.  I collaborate with people who are not programmers;
   this would allow us to collaborate more easily.
 - The set of features that would actually be required to be introduced
   could possibly lower the barrier to entry for getting into emacs that
   many run into (myself included, years ago)

In that sense, from a technical level, it looks like there are two
directions, which mostly map to the above:

1) an editing mode for ODT files that is mostly "ODT editing in emacs so
   existing emacs users can enjoy that".

   This feels like we have already a lot of the technology for; surely a
   major mode could be possible?  We already have the ability to control
   font display, we have visual-line-mode...)

   It would possibly be a lot of work to write the parser and writer for
   ODT in emacs, but probably possible.

   In a sense, this is "word processing/ODT for emacs users."

2) The other route of things is kind of more "emacs for word processing
   users", or the technical side of building user interface elements
   that emacs simply does not have.  For example, emacs users are
   probably happy to bind a key so that they can set the font size, make
   it bold, or set the color.  That's not true for many
   not-already-emacs users.  We would probably need a menu bar for such
   user interface elements similar to what libreoffice has.  Is this
   possible to do in emacs?  Maybe using the "embed GTK widgets" branch?
   Maybe these tools could only be exposed in GUI mode, and we assume
   that people using the terminal version are the users who do not
   need/want it.

#2 seems like it would take a lot more work to get to, and would involve
thinking about adding some tooling that emacs does not yet have.  #1
seems fairly possible though... and why not have it if someone is
willing to build it?  We have tetris, IRC clients, video editing, and
even opening PDF files (read-only).  It would be interesting to have ODT
support at least for emacs users' own needs.  And probably we could work
from that direction and gradually migrate to addressing #2 also.

There are a lot of reactions on this thread that seem somewhat hesitant
about emacs adding WYSIWIG support, but I suspect it's fear that #2 will
corrupt the lisp machine interfaces that we already know and
enjoy... but I doubt that the emacs community would let that happen
anyway.  But we can probably add some tooling that will make emacs more
friendly and accessible to newcomers without hurting the things we
already have.

That all said, sounds like a crazy huge project.  I guess someone would
have to step up to adding ODT support, and given the number of projects
on my plate, I cannot volunteer.  :)

 - Chris

PS: As much as I love to use org-mode to generate ODTs, it's not the
same thing.  I still get ODTs from people, and I have no way of editing
those without converting it back... I'd like just a way to collaborate
there in emacs :)