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From: "Pascal J. Bourguignon" <pjb@informatimago.com>
To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Emacs Book Vs Emacs Manuals
Date: Mon, 11 May 2015 13:27:01 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87r3qncq2i.fsf@kuiper.lan.informatimago.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: mailman.2758.1431343034.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org

phillip.lord@newcastle.ac.uk (Phillip Lord) writes:

> "Pascal J. Bourguignon" <pjb@informatimago.com> writes:
>>> Now if the cursor-keys didn't work it would not be so bad
>>> And ideal would be for them to work AND be documented
>>> But works and NOT documented/demoed in tutorial... and there are serious 
>>> allegations of ATTITUDE!
>>
>> I can't believe it.  Do you teach retards?
>
>
> I teach intelligent, interested and engaged students, whom it is my
> pleasure and privilege to introduce to programming, and show them how to
> take charge of their own computers, and have the computers work for
> them, rather than the other way around. I am sure that Rusi is in the
> same position.
>
> Over time, the experiences of people change, and the knowledge that they
> bring with them changes. This makes some things harder to understand,
> some things easier. For instance, I have the majority of my students got
> to grips with git in a day or two (which I was not expecting),
> something which has caused grief here. But running "hello world" in
> python in Emacs not easy. "Eval buffer" -- what's that then? And even
> once you've done that, where has it gone, because the shell isn't
> visible.


Be careful, soon they'll complain when you make them use a keyboard
instead of an iPad to write code…


These days, I'm starting to think that there's a deficit of CS history
teaching.

When I started programming, modern computing was only 25 years old, so
CS history was short, and even if not widely accessible outside of
academia, it was rather easy to cover it all.

While arguably nothing much has been invented since the end of the
sixties, it appears that google doesn't give easy access to the history,
giving some preference to new web sites and recent entries.  And one
must also consider that older papers and books are either not accessible
or only accessible in the deep web or behind paywalls.

Therefore it seems to me that teaching CS history would help students
widden their horizons, given the diversity of languages and OSes
already invented.


-- 
__Pascal Bourguignon__                 http://www.informatimago.com/
“The factory of the future will have only two employees, a man and a
dog. The man will be there to feed the dog. The dog will be there to
keep the man from touching the equipment.” -- Carl Bass CEO Autodesk


  parent reply	other threads:[~2015-05-11 11:27 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 137+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-05-08 10:06 Emacs Book Vs Emacs Manuals Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-08 10:36 ` Shakthi Kannan
2015-05-08 10:43   ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-08 11:08     ` tomas
2015-05-08 11:18     ` Shakthi Kannan
2015-05-08 19:10     ` Bob Proulx
2015-05-08 19:35       ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-05-10  2:48         ` Bob Proulx
     [not found]         ` <mailman.2686.1431226098.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-10  3:22           ` Emanuel Berg
2015-05-10 14:01           ` Rusi
2015-05-10 14:05             ` Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-05-11 11:17               ` Phillip Lord
     [not found]               ` <mailman.2758.1431343034.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-11 11:27                 ` Pascal J. Bourguignon [this message]
2015-05-10 15:31             ` Drew Adams
2015-05-11 11:08             ` Phillip Lord
2015-05-15 16:15             ` MBR
2015-05-15 18:45               ` Doug Lewan
     [not found]               ` <mailman.3085.1431715560.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-15 20:18                 ` Emanuel Berg
2015-05-16  4:31                   ` Yuri Khan
2015-05-18 20:57                     ` Bob Proulx
2015-06-25 14:22                   ` Ken Goldman
2015-06-26 15:03                     ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-26 20:21                       ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-06-26 22:42                         ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-27 19:29                           ` MBR
2015-06-27 22:48                             ` Emanuel Berg
     [not found]                             ` <mailman.5813.1435445379.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-28  3:45                               ` Rusi
2015-06-28 14:34                                 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-06-28 15:31                                   ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-28 15:36                                     ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-06-28 15:53                                       ` Emanuel Berg
     [not found]                         ` <mailman.5747.1435358641.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-27  3:15                           ` Rusi
2015-06-27  5:02                             ` Bob Proulx
2015-06-27  8:25                               ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-06-27 11:56                                 ` Robert Thorpe
     [not found]                                 ` <mailman.5780.1435406221.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-27 14:44                                   ` Rusi
2015-06-27 17:46                                 ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-27 17:42                             ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-29 13:03                               ` Filipp Gunbin
2015-06-29 23:51                                 ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-30  4:38                                   ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-06-30 23:26                                     ` Emanuel Berg
     [not found]                                     ` <mailman.6072.1435707010.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-07-01  0:32                                       ` Dan Espen
2015-06-30  8:10                                   ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-06-30 23:40                                     ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-30 16:56                                   ` Filipp Gunbin
2015-07-01  0:00                                     ` Emanuel Berg
     [not found]                             ` <mailman.5799.1435427076.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-27 18:12                               ` Rusi
2015-06-27 21:55                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2015-06-27 22:25                                   ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-30 10:56                                   ` keyboard-macro facility recording commands (Was: Emacs Book Vs Emacs Manuals) Steinar Bang
     [not found]                                 ` <mailman.5809.1435442174.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-06-27 22:06                                   ` Emacs Book Vs Emacs Manuals Pascal J. Bourguignon
2015-06-27 22:40                                 ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-28 14:55                                   ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-06-28 15:47                                     ` Emanuel Berg
2015-06-25 14:16               ` Ken Goldman
     [not found]             ` <mailman.3077.1431706537.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-15 20:15               ` Emanuel Berg
2015-05-08 10:53 ` Tassilo Horn
2015-05-08 13:39   ` Phillip Lord
2015-05-08 14:34     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-08 14:38     ` Tassilo Horn
2015-05-08 15:09       ` Phillip Lord
2015-05-08 15:41         ` Tassilo Horn
2015-05-08 21:54           ` Stefan Monnier
2015-05-09 10:00           ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-10 14:31         ` Steinar Bang
     [not found]     ` <mailman.2604.1431095644.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-08 14:50       ` Barry Margolin
2015-05-08 15:01         ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-08 22:06           ` Stefan Monnier
2015-05-09  9:06             ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-09  9:18             ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-09 10:38               ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-10  6:47                 ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-10 15:01                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-11  5:30                     ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-11 16:06                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-16  5:50                         ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-16  7:32                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-17 15:35                             ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-17 14:47                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-18  2:49                                 ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-18 14:15                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-19  5:50                                     ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-19 15:07                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-19 16:41                                       ` Filipp Gunbin
     [not found]                                     ` <mailman.3246.1432014638.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-19 23:58                                       ` Emanuel Berg
2015-05-10  2:45             ` Bob Proulx
2015-05-11 10:53           ` Phillip Lord
2015-05-11 15:58             ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-11 16:12               ` Stefan Monnier
2015-05-11 16:23                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-11 16:30                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-11 18:01                     ` Stefan Monnier
2015-05-11 20:38                     ` Marcin Borkowski
     [not found]                     ` <mailman.2820.1431376739.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-12  3:22                       ` Rusi
     [not found]                   ` <<83y4kvkrf5.fsf@gnu.org>
2015-05-11 17:12                     ` Drew Adams
2015-05-11 17:11                 ` Drew Adams
2015-05-11 18:06                   ` Stefan Monnier
2015-05-11 18:38                     ` Drew Adams
     [not found]                   ` <mailman.2806.1431367811.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-12  4:07                     ` Rusi
2015-05-12  8:15                       ` Rasmus
2015-05-12 16:11                       ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]                       ` <mailman.2872.1431447128.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-12 16:55                         ` Rusi
2015-05-12 17:45                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-13  7:47                             ` tomas
2015-05-13 12:10                               ` Filipp Gunbin
2015-05-13 12:32                                 ` tomas
2015-05-13 15:24                                   ` Filipp Gunbin
2015-05-13 16:37                               ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]                               ` <mailman.2958.1431535075.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-15  2:56                                 ` Rusi
2015-05-15  7:31                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]                                   ` <mailman.3052.1431675095.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-15 11:12                                     ` Rusi
2015-05-15 13:09                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-15 13:44                                         ` Phillip Lord
     [not found]                                         ` <mailman.3067.1431697490.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-15 14:01                                           ` Rusi
2015-05-15 14:36                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]                           ` <mailman.2887.1431452758.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-13  1:09                             ` Rusi
2015-05-13  2:20                               ` Drew Adams
     [not found]                 ` <mailman.2797.1431364316.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-11 17:27                   ` Rusi
2015-05-20  0:21                 ` Robert Thorpe
2015-05-08 16:35     ` Sivaram Neelakantan
2015-05-09 10:14     ` Vaidheeswaran C
     [not found] ` <mailman.2592.1431081398.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-08 13:34   ` notbob
2015-05-08 15:50 ` Drew Adams
2015-05-09  9:49   ` Vaidheeswaran C
2015-05-09 14:21     ` Jude DaShiell
2015-05-08 19:10 ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-05-09  7:47   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-09  8:07     ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-05-09  8:27       ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-09 17:34         ` Marcin Borkowski
2015-05-11 11:02     ` Phillip Lord
2015-05-11 16:03       ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-05-11 17:20         ` Phillip Lord
2015-05-11 18:04           ` Eli Zaretskii
     [not found]     ` <<87k2wfl6mo.fsf@newcastle.ac.uk>
     [not found]       ` <<83617zm78t.fsf@gnu.org>
2015-05-11 17:11         ` Drew Adams
     [not found] <mailman.2591.1431080443.904.help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
2015-05-09 22:59 ` Emanuel Berg
     [not found] <<mii1p5$ho1$1@ger.gmane.org>

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