From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Bastien Guerry Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: basic question: going back to dired Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 01:49:54 +0200 Message-ID: <87prp55vj1.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> References: <4884DC7F.6060406@gmail.com> <819feff4-76e3-4bf8-9ece-7b47f099efc2@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> <87mykaw8sb.fsf@nonospaz.fatphil.org> <87bq0prh39.fsf@bzg.ath.cx> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1216770635 5859 80.91.229.12 (22 Jul 2008 23:50:35 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2008 23:50:35 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Jul 23 01:51:23 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1KLRdY-0008Md-RH for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 01:51:21 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40050 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KLRcf-0003Ot-3V for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:50:25 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KLRcM-0003OZ-TV for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:50:06 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1KLRcL-0003Nm-KO for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:50:06 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=37362 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1KLRcL-0003Nd-Al for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:50:05 -0400 Original-Received: from fg-out-1718.google.com ([72.14.220.156]:2694) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KLRcK-0001vu-Ae for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:50:05 -0400 Original-Received: by fg-out-1718.google.com with SMTP id l26so1008356fgb.30 for ; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 16:49:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:received:from:to:subject :in-reply-to:references:user-agent:date:message-id:mime-version :content-type:sender; bh=RUJgatRS+NKdbAPz98h+5hiV1EeCwykEQMeoifGWERg=; b=rrLFeu9JCZWBjTVIC2uae0ZdX1Eg4hW/mQQzWqrqUs/hESHcC+liXZRqzTAru9LKRr dGvFlIIwjewDij/X0hUHD16moeNs37x6mJYz+gREDdUIxIjbp8sBe4j2UbD5jK1SGrLx PEEPSULWfxZ/11KjsMfDOleE71tztcSK5DZuk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=from:to:subject:in-reply-to:references:user-agent:date:message-id :mime-version:content-type:sender; b=RxqLxdYwsUcNADGs5RcCby7IepI/nBDTNNG/LviQCXBPbcXVu7nCUc0q0QROK+cSiY igpSj9wZzQ87O6uwQ0KpVY+fNpFWR0X4TBEuvXO8jMBtfg7Ssaq7Hi7L1hDVDjaNMD1w LHQR9D58qEZZ20Gpatzl1lpA/6tsCIVsd2FIE= Original-Received: by 10.103.215.4 with SMTP id s4mr4083408muq.13.1216770597951; Tue, 22 Jul 2008 16:49:57 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from bzg.ath.cx ( [90.35.197.177]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id e8sm49113950muf.0.2008.07.22.16.49.56 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Tue, 22 Jul 2008 16:49:57 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by bzg.ath.cx (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 5F59F158165; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 01:49:54 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: (Juanma Barranquero's message of "Wed, 23 Jul 2008 01:03:06 +0200") User-Agent: Gnus/5.110009 (No Gnus v0.9) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:55836 Archived-At: "Juanma Barranquero" writes: >> How many users are complaining about the fact that it's not easy to open >> and close a file with Emacs? As long as this is not a *major* problem, >> let's not consider whether it's good or not to change Emacs terminology. >> >> No? > > I don't see the relevance of that question (my fault, I'm sure). No, surely mine. I just wanted to say: if new users are not too much complaining about the terminology, let's not fix something that is not broken. > I was under the impression that the relevant question would be: "how > much difficult is for beginners to learn Emacs when they read about > buffers and frames and keybindings, instead of X and Y and Z?" [where > X, Y and Z are suitable terms commonly used in other environments] Do you seriously think that the terms "buffers, frames and keybindings" make it difficult for new users to learn Emacs? More commonly used terms are in the Glossary. See for example "shortcut" and "window": Keyboard Shortcut A keyboard shortcut is a key sequence (q.v.) which invokes a command. What some programs call "assigning a keyboard shortcut," Emacs calls "binding a key sequence." See `binding.' Window Emacs divides a frame (q.v.) into one or more windows, each of which can display the contents of one buffer (q.v.) at any time. *Note Screen::, for basic information on how Emacs uses the screen. *Note Windows::, for commands to control the use of windows. Some other editors use the term "window" for what we call a `frame' (q.v.) in Emacs. It's clear, and new users can find this easily. We could have another ones for "workspace" and "tab" but I think it would be confusing. -- Bastien